Wikipedia:In the news/Candidates

This page provides a place to discuss new items for inclusion on In the news (ITN), a protected template on the Main Page (see past items in the ITN archives). Do not report errors in ITN items that are already on the Main Page here— discuss those at the relevant section of WP:ERRORS.

This candidates page is integrated with the daily pages of Portal:Current events. A light green header appears under each daily section – it includes transcluded Portal:Current events items for that day. You can discuss ITN candidates under the header.

Michel Barnier Typhoon Yagi leaves more than 200 people dead across six Asian countries. Michel Barnier (pictured) is appointed prime minister of France by President Emmanuel Macron, leading to nationwide anti-government protests. An attempted jailbreak at Makala Central Prison in Kinshasa, Democratic Republic of the Congo, leaves 129 people dead. A Mil Mi-8 helicopter crashes in Kamchatka, Russia, killing all 22 people on board. Ongoing: Israel–Hamas war timeline Russian invasion of Ukraine timeline Sudanese civil war timeline Recent deaths: Paul Goldsmith Herbie Flowers Noel Parmentel Hans-Ulrich Schmincke James Earl Jones Ana Gervasi view — page history — related changes — edit

Glossary Blurbs are one-sentence summaries of the news story. Altblurbs, labelled alt1, alt2, etc., are alternative suggestions to cover the same story. A target article, bolded in text, is the focus of the story. Each blurb must have at least one such article, but you may also link non-target articles. Articles in the Ongoing line describe events getting continuous coverage. The Recent deaths (RD) line includes any living thing whose death was recently announced. Consensus may decide to create a blurb for a recent death. All articles linked in the ITN template must pass our standards of review. They should be up-to-date, demonstrate relevance via good sourcing and have at least an acceptable quality. Nomination steps Make sure the item you want to nominate has an article that meets our minimum requirements and contains reliable coverage of a current event you want to create a blurb about. We will not post about events described in an article that fails our quality standards. Find the correct section below for the date of the event (not the date nominated). Do not add sections for new dates manually – a bot does that for us each day at midnight (UTC). Create a level 4 header with the article name (==== Your article here ====). Add (RD) or (Ongoing) if appropriate. Then paste the {{ITN candidate}} template with its parameters and fill them in. The news source should be reliable, support your nomination and be in the article. Write your blurb in simple present tense. Below the template, briefly explain why we should post that event. After that, save your edit. Your nomination is ready! You may add {{ITN note}} to the target article's talk page to let editors know about your nomination. The better your article's quality, the better it covers the event and the wider its perceived significance (see WP:ITNSIGNIF for details), the better your chances of getting the blurb posted. Headers When the article is ready, updated and there is consensus to post, you can mark the item as (Ready). Remove that wording if you feel the article fails any of these necessary criteria. Admins should always separately verify whether these criteria are met before posting blurbs marked (Ready). For more guidance, check WP:ITN/A. If satisfied, change the header to (Posted). Where there is no consensus, or the article's quality remains poor, change the header to (Closed) or (Not posted). Sometimes, editors ask to retract an already-posted nomination because of a fundamental error or because consensus changed. If you feel the community supports this, remove the item and mark the item as (Pulled). Voicing an opinion on an item Format your comment to contain "support" or "oppose", and include a rationale for your choice. In particular, address the notability of the event, the quality of the article, and whether it has been updated. Please do... Pick an older item to review near the bottom of this page, before the eligibility runs out and the item scrolls off the page and gets abandoned in the archive, unused and forgotten. Review an item even if it has already been reviewed by another user. You may be the first to spot a problem, or the first to confirm that an identified problem was fixed. Piling on the list of "support!" votes will help administrators see what is ready to be posted on the Main Page. Tell about problems in articles if you see them. Be bold and fix them yourself if you know how, or tell others if it's not possible. Please do not... Add simple "support!" or "oppose!" votes without including your reasons. Similarly, curt replies such as "who?", "meh", or "duh!" are not helpful. A vote without reasoning means little for us, please elaborate yourself. Oppose an item just because the event is only relating to a single country, or failing to relate to one. We post a lot of such content, so these comments are generally unproductive. Accuse other editors of supporting, opposing or nominating due to a personal bias (such as ethnocentrism). We at ITN do not handle conflicts of interest. Comment on a story without first reading the relevant article(s). Oppose a recurring item here because you disagree with the recurring items criteria. Discuss them here. Use ITN as a forum for your own political or personal beliefs. Such comments are irrelevant to the outcome and are potentially disruptive. Suggesting updates There are two places where you can request corrections to posted items: Anything that does not change the intent of the blurb (spelling, grammar, markup issues, updating death tolls etc.) should be discussed at WP:Errors. Discuss major changes in the blurb's intent or very complex updates as part of the current ITNC nomination.

Archives

Archives of posted stories: Wikipedia:In the news/Posted/Archives

September 13

Portal:Current events/2024 September 13
September 13, 2024 (2024-09-13) (Friday)

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September 12

Portal:Current events/2024 September 12

September 12, 2024 (2024-09-12) (Thursday) Armed conflicts and attacks Russian invasion of Ukraine Eastern Ukraine campaign Russian artillery shelling kills three Red Cross workers and injures two others in Donetsk Oblast, Ukraine. (Reuters) Foreign involvement in the Russian invasion of Ukraine A spokesperson for the Indian Foreign Ministry say that about 45 Indian nationals have been discharged from the Russian Army, with efforts currently underway to get a further 50 Indians released. (Reuters) Kharkiv strikes Russian shelling of the settlement of Borova in Kharkiv Oblast, Ukraine, kills three civilians and injures nine others, including several emergency service personnel. (Reuters) Military aid to Ukraine during the Russo-Ukrainian War, Russia–NATO relations Russian president Vladimir Putin warns that Ukrainian use of NATO weapons to strike deep into Russian territory indicates NATO's formal entry into war against Russia, due to the programming of these weapons by NATO personnel representing a "direct confrontation". (The Independent) Southern Ukraine campaign Ukraine accuses Russia of conducting missile strikes on a Saint Kitts and Nevis-flagged bulk carrier carrying grain to Egypt in the exclusive economic zone of Romania in the Black Sea. No casualties are reported. (Reuters) Israel–Hamas war 2024 Israeli military operation in the West Bank The death toll from Israel's military operation in the occupied West Bank increases to 50, with three people killed by a drone strike in Tulkarm. (Al Jazeera) United States support for Israel in the Israel–Hamas war The U.S. State Department approves $165 million in weapons sales to Israel to fund tank transporters along with spare parts, tool kits, and technical and logistics support. The parts are expected to be delivered in 2027. (AP) Business and economy 2023–2024 video game industry layoffs Microsoft announces that it will lay off 650 Microsoft Gaming employees as part of cuts to its workforce. (Variety) Health and environment The British government announces that a ban on junk food adverts on television before 9 PM will enter force in October 2025 under plans to tackle childhood obesity. (Sky News) International relations Jordan–United Kingdom relations The United Kingdom suspends visa-exempt status for Jordanian nationals traveling to the UK due to an increase in asylum claims made by Jordanians. (The Jerusalem Post) Peace negotiations in the Russian invasion of Ukraine, Brazil–Ukraine relations, China–Ukraine relations Ukrainian president Volodymyr Zelenskyy strongly denounces a Brazilian–Chinese peace initiative, stating that both nations are effectively siding with Russia for allowing the Russian army to take Ukrainian territory as a means to "de-escalate" the war instead of assisting Ukraine in resisting the invasion. (Kyiv Independent) United States–Venezuela relations, 2024 Venezuelan political crisis The United States government imposes sanctions on 16 allies of Venezuelan president Nicolás Maduro, accusing them of voter suppression and human rights abuses. (AP) The United States announces it will support the addition of two new permanent seats on the United Nations Security Council for African nations and one non-permanent seat for a small island developing nation. (AP) Law and crime Blasphemy in Pakistan A police officer shoots and kills a man being held in custody on suspicion of blasphemy at a police station in Quetta, Balochistan, Pakistan. (Al Arabiya) Politics and elections Papuan prime minister James Marape survives a vote of no confidence. (RNZ) President of Senegal Bassirou Diomaye Faye dissolves the opposition-led National Assembly and calls for a snap election on November 17. (AP) Science and technology Polaris program American billionaire Jared Isaacman becomes the first person to perform a commercial spacewalk as part of the Polaris Dawn private spaceflight mission operated by SpaceX. (AP)

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Ongoing: Typhoon Yagi (Withdraw)

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

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Article: Typhoon Yagi (talk · history · tag)
Ongoing item nomination (Post)
Credits:

• Nominated by HurricaneEdgar (talk · give credit)

Nominator's comments: The article is up for updates, despite the storm having dissipated, as it continues to be reported that people are dying across various Asian countries. HurricaneEdgar 21:37, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

• Oppose As you say, the storm has dissipated. All the subsequent daily death in the world won't change that. Every event has an aftermath. InedibleHulk (talk) 23:59, 12 September 2024 (UTC)
• Oppose It’s currently the top blurb & it’s dissipated, so there’s no need to put it in “Ongoing“. Blaylockjam10 (talk) 00:17, 13 September 2024 (UTC)

Oppose What's ongoing about a storm that is no longer ongoing? RachelTensions (talk) 02:15, 13 September 2024 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

RD: Stephen Peat

Article: Stephen Peat (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): The Province, Sportsnet
Credits:

• Updated and nominated by GhostRiver (talk · give credit)

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Troubled ex-NHLer was struck by a car two weeks ago. Succumbed to his injuries today. Have spent the afternoon buffing up the article and making sure everything important is cited. — GhostRiver 21:38, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

• Support Well-buffed, GhostRiver. InedibleHulk (talk) 00:25, 13 September 2024 (UTC)

Polaris Dawn

Article: Polaris Dawn (talk · history · tag)
Blurb: ​ Jared Isaacman and Sarah Gillis conduct the first commercial spacewalk during the Polaris Dawn private space mission. (Post)
News source(s): NYT, Guardian
Credits:

• Nominated by Sandstein (talk · give credit)

No strong feelings either way, but we normally post space firsts, right? Sandstein 15:55, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

• Comment: data in the table of launch attempts seems only sparsely cited. Do we feel that this qualifies as a "first", given that spacewalks themselves are routine -- the difference here is who has organised/funded it? UndercoverClassicist ^T·C 15:59, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

That's certainly up for debate, although the media do treat this as a "first", reflecting the increasing commercialization and privatization of spaceflight. Sandstein 16:04, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

• Support a first for space exploration. Scuba 16:17, 12 September 2024 (UTC)
• Support - In The News, major milestone in human spaceflight PrecariousWorlds (talk) 16:25, 12 September 2024 (UTC)
• Oppose - It's not a major milestone in human spaceflight. It's a small milestone in the organisational backing of human spaceflight. Operationally, a spacewalk is a spacewalk. GenevieveDEon (talk) 16:29, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

I guess every major news outlet is just lying in saying that the first commercial spacewalk is a major milestone. Scuba 16:34, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

It's hype. News outlets frequently produce hype. Of more interest on the operational front is that this was a spacewalk without airlocks. To my mind 'first commercial spacewalk' is one of those excessively-specific superlatives, like 'tallest actor' or 'first Frenchman to cycle around the world'. I don't see the operational activity's dependence on the commercial organisation supporting it as especially remarkable. GenevieveDEon (talk) 16:44, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

I don't understand the point you're trying to make, the superlatives that you listed exist and aren't that ridiculous. It being commercial is the whole point, the commercial space race has been proof that the age of big bloated government agencies dominating every aspect of space travel is over. SpaceX doesn't get 0.48% of the US budget every year to only make one rocket every 4 years like NASA with SLS. Scuba 03:50, 13 September 2024 (UTC)

Agree with GenevieveDEon. This is just a hyped up news story because of SpaceX, and because of a billionaire who is part of the team. What is fundamentally different from this and other spacewalks, which have been done numerous times by NASA or Roscosmos astronauts? We have already posted other "firsts" for commercial spaceflight, but this to me is an insignificant "first". Natg 19 (talk) 16:39, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

Because it isn't being done by NASA or Roscosmos or any governmental agency, it's being done by a private company. Scuba 03:52, 13 September 2024 (UTC)

• Support - This is still a big deal; it really doesn't matter if a billionaire was involved. Inspiration4 was blurbed as it was the first all-civilian spaceflight, I feel like the first ever commercial spacewalk should get the same treatment. qw3rty 17:29, 12 September 2024 (UTC)
• Support - in addition to the big media coverage for the first commercial spacewalk, also of significance is that the earth orbit achieved an altitude of over 1,400 kilometres - breaking the 1,370 km crewed record set in 1966 by Gemini 11/Agena. (of course the moonshot orbits were technically higher, so technically the Apollo missions were further away while trans-lunar or in lunar orbit. There's also been a new record set of 19 people in earth orbit simultaneously (on two space stations, with 5 capsules - Polaris Dawn, Soyuz MS-25, Soyuz MS-26, SpaceX Crew-8, and Shenzhou 18. Arguably, each of these three records should be blurbed. Combining into one seems more than reasonable. Nfitz (talk) 18:09, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

I don't think any of those should be blurbed. They're all just 'mosts' of things we don't normally pay attention to measuring at all. And if we're talking about the achievements of private space flight, one of the things it has done is to raise the number of people currently in Earth orbit by stranding two people on the ISS for six months. I also don't think that an altitude record that arbitrarily excludes the Apollo astronauts is a record at all. GenevieveDEon (talk) 21:36, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

• Apparently also the most people in vacuum at once, per the article. Sandstein 18:56, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

• Comment per our article it wasn't a space walk... The cabin was open to space, and both persons stood at the opening but dud not leave the ship. It's a progressive step but not really a full space walk. Masem (t) 18:36, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

  And yet the couple in the part of the unpressurized Mir station (coming from a pressurized Soyuz after the Progress M-34 collision) are called spacewalks. And what about Apollo 9? Nfitz (talk) 19:37, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

  Both of those cases have crew moving between two vessels, even if the distance was short. — Masem (t) 20:08, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

  the crew moved here too. Isaacman stuck himself out the hatch, and then went back in. How is that any different? Scuba 03:53, 13 September 2024 (UTC)

  I feel like this is an arbitrary distinction to be made. PrecariousWorlds (talk) 23:01, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

• Oppose per GDE above, especially then finding out that it wasn't actually even a full space walk, per Masem. Slidinghorn (talk) 18:53, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

RD: Sitaram Yechury

Article: Sitaram Yechury (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination
Blurb:  Indian communist leader Sitaram Yechury dies at the age of 72. (Post)
Alternative blurb: ​ Sitaram Yechury General Secretary of Communist Party of India (India National party), dies at the age of 72.
News source(s): BBC,Indianexpress
Credits:

• Nominated by Pharaoh of the Wizards (talk · give credit)
• Updated by Pachu Kannan (talk · give credit) and Spworld2 (talk · give credit)

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Indian communist leader Pharaoh of the Wizards (talk) 11:08, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

• Wait - The 'Books' section of his article is entirely unsourced. Would support once this is fixed. - Bucket of sulfuric acid (talk | contribs) 11:50, 12 September 2024 (UTC)
• Support Added sources in the "Books" section. Pachu Kannan (talk) 14:07, 12 September 2024 (UTC)
• Support Communist Indian leader (Major figures) (WP:ITNRDBLURB) ~ Spworld2 (talk) 9:12, 13 September 2024 (UTC)

(Ready) RD: Aussie Malcolm

Article: Aussie Malcolm (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Stuff
Credits:

• Updated and nominated by Abcmaxx (talk · give credit)

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Missing exact date of death, announced today; otherwise good article. Abcmaxx (talk) 07:26, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

• Support Looks good. Vacant0 (talk • contribs) 10:33, 12 September 2024 (UTC)
• Support Article looks in good enough shape, though could use a bit of expansion (I'll try to do that if I have the time). Kiwichris (talk) 10:55, 12 September 2024 (UTC)
• Support - Adequately sourced and overall in good shape. - Bucket of sulfuric acid (talk | contribs) 11:58, 12 September 2024 (UTC)
• Support. Structure looks good enough and no problems found. 🛧Midori No Sora♪🛪 ( ☁＝☁＝✈) 21:24, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

September 11

Portal:Current events/2024 September 11

September 11, 2024 (2024-09-11) (Wednesday) Armed conflicts and attacks Israel–Hamas war Israeli invasion of the Gaza Strip September 2024 Al-Jawni School attack Eighteen people, including six UNRWA staffers, are killed in Israeli airstrikes on a school in central Gaza. (Reuters) An Israeli Air Force UH-60 Black Hawk helicopter crashes in Rafah during a mission to evacuate an injured combat engineer, killing two personnel on board. (Times of Israel) 2024 Israeli military operation in the West Bank At least six Palestinians are killed by an Israeli drone strike on Tubas in the West Bank. (Reuters) Russian invasion of Ukraine August 2024 Kursk Oblast incursion Russian forces reportedly recapture 10 settlements in Kursk Oblast. (Anadolu Agency) Military aid to Ukraine during the Russo-Ukrainian War The United Kingdom reportedly approves the use of Storm Shadow cruise missiles to strike targets inside Russian territory. (The Kyiv Independent) Israel–Hezbollah conflict One Hezbollah militant is killed and one militant and two civilians are injured in Israeli drone strikes in southern Lebanon. (Al Jazeera) Business and economy Hundreds of workers at Jomo Kenyatta International Airport in Nairobi, Kenya, go on strike to protest against a planned deal to lease the airport to the Indian conglomerate Adani Group for 30 years. (Al Jazeera) Disasters and accidents 2024 Atlantic hurricane season Hurricane Francine makes landfall in Terrebonne Parish, Louisiana, United States, as a Category 2 hurricane. (National Hurricane Center) The National Weather Service issues a flash flood emergency for New Orleans and municipalities west of it, due to the eye wall of Hurricane Francine stalling over the region. (NBC News) 2024 Nigeria floods More than of the 80% of the animals in the Sanda Kyarimi Park Zoo in Maiduguri, Borno State, Nigeria, are killed by heavy floods. (Reuters) 2024 Pacific typhoon season The death toll from Typhoon Yagi in northern Vietnam increases to 179 people, with 145 others still missing. The majority of the victims were killed by floods and landslides in Lào Cai, Yên Bái, and Cao Bằng provinces. (AP) (Al Jazeera) Law and crime Malaysian police rescue 400 minors suspected of being sexually abused at Islamic charity homes linked to Al-Arqam. (Reuters) Politics and elections Israel–Hamas war protests Victoria Police arrest 39 people and fire stun grenades, rubber bullets, and pepper spray at anti-war and pro-Palestinian protestors picketing outside a military weapons expo in Melbourne, Australia. (Al Jazeera) Women's rights in Afghanistan An All Afghan Women's Summit is held in Tirana, Albania, where more than 130 Afghan women gathered to protest the crackdown on women's rights by the Taliban. (The Guardian)

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RD: Joe Schmidt

Article: Joe Schmidt (American football) (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): ABC News
Credits:

• Nominated by 240F:7A:6253:1:7C78:E248:64B1:15 (talk · give credit)
• Updated by Mrman717 (talk · give credit) and Goosedukeee (talk · give credit)

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Hall of Fame Detroit Lions linebacker and two-time NFL champion. 240F:7A:6253:1:7C78:E248:64B1:15 (talk) 22:25, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

• Support meets basic ITNC criteria of citations, format, etc. ❤HistoryTheorist❤ 00:07, 13 September 2024 (UTC)

(Ready) RD/blurb: Alberto Fujimori

Articles: Alberto Fujimori (talk · history · tag) and Death of Alberto Fujimori (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination
Blurb:  Former President of Peru Alberto Fujimori dies at the age of 86. (Post)
Alternative blurb: ​ Former President of Peru Alberto Fujimori dies at the age of 86.
Alternative blurb II: ​ Former dictator and President of Peru Alberto Fujimori dies at the age of 86.
News source(s): AP
Credits:

• Nominated by Sunshineisles2 (talk · give credit)
• Updated by Namealreadytak (talk · give credit), Jkaharper (talk · give credit) and Moscow Mule (talk · give credit)

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Former Peruvian dictator. Sunshineisles2 (talk) 00:01, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

• Not Ready Multiple tags and issues including serious gaps in referencing. This one is going to need some work before it can be posted. -Ad Orientem (talk) 01:21, 12 September 2024 (UTC)
• Support because he was a former head of state who assumed power in a self-coup, and has exceptional notability for RD. JohnAdams1800 (talk) 03:28, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

  Per ITNRD, posting is automatic subject only to article quality. The question here is whether or not the article's overall quality meets the customary standards for posting on the main page. -Ad Orientem (talk) 03:36, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

  I think this was in relation to the blurb, given the quality isn't up to scratch Abcmaxx (talk) 06:55, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

• Support on principle I could make a number of connections, but for ITNC, I think that if AF could be improved by the end of this week, it would merit a blurb. Not ready because we need to debate dictatorship, controversy, etc. ❤HistoryTheorist❤ 04:02, 12 September 2024 (UTC)
  • Update: nearly there If not for the deletion tag, I think that Fujimori's article is just about ready to go. If necessary, we could drop the death fork of Fujimori and add it when it's caught up. ❤HistoryTheorist❤ 00:09, 13 September 2024 (UTC)
• support blurb. Former head of state.Sportsnut24 (talk) 05:53, 12 September 2024 (UTC)
• Almost there -- would support for RD if remaining CN tags were addressed. Weak support for blurb: do we normally post blurbs for any former head of state? If not, would need some convincing. UndercoverClassicist ^T·C 06:42, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

  Quality issues have been addressed in terms of sourcing from what I can see. TDKR Chicago 101 (talk) 21:08, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

• Oppose blurb. We should not be venerating dictators, and his death in itself is not significant, he has been very ill and in prison for a long time and was 86. Abcmaxx (talk) 06:50, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

  I have no strong opinion on the posting, but I want to make it absolutely clear that posting a blurb to ITN is not 'veneration'. If Vladimir Putin drops dead tomorrow (or at any other time, in fact), I would absolutely !vote for a blurb; I would certainly not regard that !vote, or the subsequent appearance of such a blurb at ITN as 'veneration'. GenevieveDEon (talk) 16:31, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

• Oppose blurb OLDMANDIES This post was made by orbitalbuzzsaw gang (talk) 06:53, 12 September 2024 (UTC)
• Support blurb in principle, with no comment on article quality or sourcing. Alberto Fujimori was, for better or for worse, a major figure in modern Peruvian history. He was a consequential enough figure to merit a blurb. Kurtis ^(talk) 07:06, 12 September 2024 (UTC)
• Support blurb He was definitely a very notable leader in Latin America who made drastic changes in the politics of his country, so he's certainly more notable than routine leaders that simply adapt to the system as given. The fact his presidency is considered "dictatorship" is irrelevant. There are other "dictators" in the world whose deaths were given a blurb (e.g. Fidel Castro, Robert Mugabe, Jiang Zemin etc.).--Kiril Simeonovski (talk) 07:15, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

  I believe it should at least be acknowledged in the blurb. President for life is not what someone thinks when reading the title "president". Added altblurb2 Abcmaxx (talk) 07:51, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

  I don't know where did you get that information from. He wasn't president for life as his presidency ended in 2000 when he resigned.--Kiril Simeonovski (talk) 08:38, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

  Yeah but his actions indicated he sure wanted to be. Abcmaxx (talk) 12:30, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

• Needs work Lots of work. I started today by reading the NYT's account. That read quite well and it was certainly an interesting life. Then I read through our article and it came across as much more unpolished for which "never mind the quality, feel the width" seems appropriate.

Note that the Spanish language article has a much larger readership and seems influential as the leads of the English and Spanish versions are remarkably similar. It's not clear which language is the original and which the translation or whether there's two-way traffic. There's a similar issue with the man himself – whether he was the master of his fate or just a figurehead controlled by others.

Andrew🐉(talk) 07:40, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

Quality issues have been addressed in terms of sourcing. TDKR Chicago 101 (talk) 21:05, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

• Support blurb: An extremely polarising figure that has been made notable around the world. Article does need a lot of work but will support in principle. Tofusaurus (talk) 11:56, 12 September 2024 (UTC)
• Support blurb This one should be a no-brainer. A former head of state who was a notorious political figure in his region, convicted of human rights abuses and was a consequential political figure in Peru and possibly in his respective continent. Article does need quality work though. --TDKR Chicago 101 (talk) 12:35, 12 September 2024 (UTC)
• Oppose on quality, far too many CNs and unsourced paragraphs throughout. I am glad to see a legacy section which helps towards supporting a blurb though I'm not sure its written in the way to make sure it presents him as, as TDKR Chicago says, "a notorious political figure", and should be retouched to try to strength that approach if we are going to post as a blurb. --Masem (t) 12:54, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

  Quality issues have been addressed in terms of sourcing. TDKR Chicago 101 (talk) 21:05, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

  Yes, just looked through and see one "needs context" but that's not a show stopper. Can't easily edit my vote above right now but that's a support for RD, weak support on blurb (don't think we need the separate death article, and like to see that "criticism" section titled something else buy don't know what) — Masem (t) 22:36, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

• Oppose on Quality per concerns mentioned previously. However, I really think Fujimori is the sort of person worthy of a death blurb at ITN. Impactful and controversial politician that had a heavy hand in shaping modern Peruvian politics and it's discord. The human rights abuse charges obviously stand as the massive events of his tenure as president, as well as the coup that got him in power. DarkSide830 (talk) 15:53, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

  Quality issues have been addressed in terms of sourcing from what I can see TDKR Chicago 101 (talk) 21:07, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

• Support blurb Man has an entire political ideology named after him and was the longtime president of a country. If that doesn't warrant a blurb for an RD than nothing should ever warrant a blurb for an RD. Scuba 16:19, 12 September 2024 (UTC)
• Support blurb I would say that alternative blurb 2 should be posted Egg470 (talk) 16:57, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

Using loaded terms is not for articles, let alone the main page.Sportsnut24 (talk) 00:34, 13 September 2024 (UTC)

• Support blurb Head of state of 30 million people for a full decade. Judicial issues about his presidency lasted for the rest of his life, so he hardly died quietly and remotely. See Fujimorism for how many parties claim his ideology or have had it attributed to them. Comments about whether his rule was democratic or pleasant are neither here nor there. Nobody can doubt that Putin and Assad have influenced the 21st century, for what many people would say was for the worse. Unknown Temptation (talk) 17:28, 12 September 2024 (UTC)
• A Life Story As with the voice of Darth Vader, the body of Darth Vader or Big Van Vader himself, these are also past accomplishments. When most people think of "news", they think "current events". What's recently happened to Fujimori (the blurb you're voting on) is what happens to all of us, sooner or later. InedibleHulk (talk) 19:53, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

  It's why ITN is about featuring quality articles that are in the news, not about featuring the news. That a (likely) great figure died, as reported in the news, and we have an article that is nearly there for quality and demonstrating the great figure-Ness, is exactly the reason to post. It just still has some quality issues to resolve first — Masem (t) 20:12, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

  By the time this article's quality is even good enough to post, it won't be much in the news anymore. Then there's the two weeks or so it'll sit even staler on the Main Page after most editors figure there's no reason to improve it beyond passable. It might make his fandom happy for a day. InedibleHulk (talk) 20:39, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

  The article appears to be well sourced now. With a quick look, there's no orange tags or cn tags/unsourced statements from what I can see. TDKR Chicago 101 (talk) 21:07, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

  As a nonfan (nor love-to-hater), that's happiness enough for one day for me; still can't support blurbing it on account of the two weeks or so it'll seem staler later; I'll Support Normal or Photo RD, though, on your word. InedibleHulk (talk) 21:55, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

  [ideally a good it item that is due to an existing topic now being in the news (like RD blurbs) show already be close to high quality for posting and just needs a bit of intense polish withon 24hr to post it more timely. We've had RD blurbs before that were so far off the quality mark that posed a problem. Not the case here — Masem (t) 22:38, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

  Whatever you said, it doesn't sway me. InedibleHulk (talk) 23:33, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

• Support blurb He's a household name. Even in my native Mauritius, everybody knows who he is. His rule has left quite a mark
• Support blurb article seems ready. A democratically elected president, who becomes dictator after a self-coup, who is overthrown by Congress, is exiled in the country of his parents' origin, is convicted of crimes against humanity, is the patriarch of a nysaga of politicians and his pardon brings a lot of controversy is, without a doubt, a perfect candidate for his death to have blurb. _-_Alsor (talk) 22:37, 12 September 2024 (UTC)
• Support blurb A notorious former president of a country. ArionStar (talk) 03:34, 13 September 2024 (UTC)

Judicial reform bill in Mexico

Article: 2024 Mexican judicial reform (talk · history · tag)
Blurb: ​ The Congress of Mexico approves sweeping reforms of the country's judiciary after protestors storm the Senate chamber. (Post)
Alternative blurb: ​ Amid widespread protests, Mexico ratifies constitutional changes that will see the entire federal judiciary chosen by popular vote.
News source(s): Guardian, BBC News HRW
Credits:

• Nominated by Moscow Mule (talk · give credit)
• Created by ElijahPepe (talk · give credit)
• Updated by EchoLuminary (talk · give credit)

Article updated

Senate chamber stormed; constitutional amendments criticized by HRW, etc., passed. Moscow Mule (talk) 17:25, 11 September 2024 (UTC)

• Wait — I expected this to appear here. This is not law yet; a majority of state legislatures need to approve it. However, it will very likely pass. elijahpepe@wikipedia (he/him) 17:49, 11 September 2024 (UTC)

True on both counts. But the Senate was the major hurdle to overcome: the ruling coalition controls 27 (?) of the state congresses, so it's just a matter of time. And the storming of the Senate chamber is big news this morning, although its treatment in our articles is somewhat cursory. (Not going to be that guy who replies to every comment, I promise.) Moscow Mule (talk) 18:24, 11 September 2024 (UTC)

• Wait for final passage but agree this is a major change in Mexico's govt particularly on the corruption angle. Masem (t) 18:44, 11 September 2024 (UTC)
• Needs work There's repeated reference to amparo as an issue but this Spanish word and concept is not explained. Andrew🐉(talk) 20:38, 11 September 2024 (UTC)

Support Congrats to Mexico getting rid of it's independent judiciary, I look forward to seeing the backlash to their one-party state with an unchecked executive. Scu ba (talk) 21:17, 11 September 2024 (UTC)

The personalized commentary is unnecessary. The Kip ^(contribs) 06:05, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

• Oppose - it's a long way from ratification. Rather wonky isn't it? Nfitz (talk) 02:09, 12 September 2024 (UTC)
• Wait per above - we don't post things prematurely, but it's objective a massive moment in Mexican politics. The Senate storming/protest received fairly widespread attention as well. The Kip ^(contribs) 06:06, 12 September 2024 (UTC)
• Wait until passed into law. UndercoverClassicist ^T·C 06:42, 12 September 2024 (UTC)
• Wait until ratification. As Nfitz points out, it's still a long way from there. 31.44.224.222 (talk) 11:21, 12 September 2024 (UTC)
• Update: 18 of 32 states have ratified and the plan is to enact it on 15 Sept. Moscow Mule (talk) 15:52, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

  So we should update the hook then. Also, I'd specify at least a direction of changes, even Szmenderowiecki (talk) 02:25, 13 September 2024 (UTC)

RD: Didier Roustan

Article: Didier Roustan (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): L'Equipe, Le Monde (both in French)
Credits:

• Updated and nominated by Joseph2302 (talk · give credit)

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Died this morning, and article looks reasonable enough. Very little info on his death seems to be available right now. Joseph2302 (talk) 10:24, 11 September 2024 (UTC)

• Support Short but adequate. -Ad Orientem (talk) 01:23, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

September 10

Portal:Current events/2024 September 10

September 10, 2024 (2024-09-10) (Tuesday) Armed conflicts and attacks Russian invasion of Ukraine Attacks in Russia during the Russian invasion of Ukraine Ukraine launches drone attacks on multiple Oblasts of Russia, including Moscow, prompting all flights to be suspended at Vnukovo International Airport and Moscow Domodedovo Airport. Bryansk Governor Alexander Bogomaz says that at least 59 Ukrainian drones have been shot down over the region. Russia also reports that two people were killed in the Ukrainian drone attack on Moscow. (Reuters) (Times of Israel) Iran and the Russian invasion of Ukraine, International sanctions against Iran U.S. Secretary of State Antony Blinken says that Russia has received a shipment of Fath 360 tactical ballistic missiles from Iran, and expects their deployment "within weeks". Iran denies the claim, calling it "psychological warfare". In response, the United Kingdom, France, and Germany announce new sanctions on Iran for supplying Russia with ballistic missiles. (BBC News) (The Telegraph) Military aid to Ukraine during the Russo-Ukrainian War The Netherlands lifts all of its weapons restrictions on military equipment that it provided to Ukraine, allowing the Ukrainian military to target Russia with long-range weapons, while also urging NATO allies to lift their own weapons restrictions. (Kyiv Post) Israel–Hamas war Israeli invasion of the Gaza Strip According to Hamas, at least 40 people are killed and more than 60 others are injured in an Israeli airstrike on the Al-Mawasi refugee camp in Rafah in the Gaza Strip. Twenty tents housing displaced people are destroyed during the attack. (Al Jazeera) The Israeli military says the strike targeted senior Hamas commanders operating in a command center embedded inside a designated humanitarian area whom the Israel Defense Forces says were all involved in the October 7 attack. (Al Arabiya) (Times of Israel) Israel–Hezbollah conflict A Redwan Force commander is killed and fourteen civilians are injured in Israeli airstrikes on Saghbine and Rachaf in southern Lebanon. (Al Jazeera) Disasters and accidents The death toll from the capsizing of a migrant boat off the coast of Senegal over the weekend increases to 26 after the discovery of 17 more bodies. (Reuters) International relations Belarus–European Union border crisis, Germany–Poland relations Prime Minister of Poland Donald Tusk condemns Germany's new land border restrictions due to Germany's previous lack of support for other European Union nations impacted by irregular migration. (Reuters) (TVN24) Law and crime The Court of Justice of the European Union rules that Apple Inc. must pay €13 billion (US$14.3 billion) to the government of the Republic of Ireland as compensation for extraordinarily low taxes levied by Ireland against Apple. (Euronews) Google is fined €2.4 billion (US$2.7 billion) by the Court of Justice of the European Union for favoring its own shopping search results over those of its competitors. (Politico) His Majesty's Prison Service begins releasing thousands of prisoners in England and Wales early amid a record high prison population and a shortage of prison cells for new inmates. (BBC News) A Swiss appeals court convicts Islamic scholar Tariq Ramadan of rape and sexual coercion, sentencing Ramadan to three years in prison, with two years suspension. (Al Jazeera) (BBC News) Politics and elections 2024 Jordanian general election Jordanians go to the polls to elect all 138 members of the House of Representatives. (NPR) 2024 Mexican judicial reform Protesters opposed to the ruling Morena party's reform package storm the Senate of Mexico and force an interruption of the bill's first reading in the upper house. The session reconvenes later at an alternative venue and passes the bill by an 86–41 vote. (The Guardian) (CNN) 2021–present United Kingdom cost-of-living crisis The House of Commons of the United Kingdom votes 348–228 to end the Winter Fuel Payment for 10 million pensioners in England and Wales after Prime Minister Keir Starmer warned that the scheme was no longer affordable to be applied universally. (Sky News) 2024 United States presidential election A presidential debate hosted by ABC News between U.S. vice president and Democratic nominee Kamala Harris and former president and Republican nominee Donald Trump takes place at the National Constitution Center in Philadelphia, Pennsylvania. (CNN)

---

RD: Jim Sasser

Article: Jim Sasser (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): The New York Times
Credits:

• Nominated by Pharaoh of the Wizards (talk · give credit)

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Senator from Tennessee Pharaoh of the Wizards (talk) 11:24, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

• Not Ready. Due to the usual reason. 🛧Midori No Sora♪🛪 ( ☁＝☁＝✈) 21:26, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

RD: Emi Shinohara

Article: Emi Shinohara (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Anime News Network, Nikkan Sports
Credits:

• Nominated by Miraclepine (talk · give credit)

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Voice of Sailor Jupiter, announced today. Page biography is sourced, but filmography will need to be sourced. ミラP@Miraclepine 01:21, 11 September 2024 (UTC)

• Oppose per the usual reason. Filmography is the only thing holding this back, though - rest looks good. The Kip ^(contribs) 06:10, 12 September 2024 (UTC)
• Support. The missing citations have been added and the article structure looks good enough. Great work. 🛧Midori No Sora♪🛪 ( ☁＝☁＝✈) 21:29, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

September 9

Portal:Current events/2024 September 9

September 9, 2024 (2024-09-09) (Monday) Armed conflicts and attacks Russian invasion of Ukraine Eastern Ukraine campaign Russian troops capture the village of Memryk in Donetsk Oblast, Ukraine. (Al Jazeera) Russia–NATO relations The Latvian Defence Ministry confirms that a Russian military Shahed drone that crashed near the village of Gaigalava, Latvia, last week was carrying explosives and was likely intended to strike Ukraine. (Reuters) Use of incendiary weapons in the Russo-Ukrainian War Ukraine begins the implementation of "dragon drones" that spray molten thermite on forest cover to reveal and help destroy Russian units and military equipment. (Al Jazeera) Israel–Hamas war Israeli invasion of the Gaza Strip At least eight people are killed and dozens are wounded in Israeli strikes across the Gaza Strip, bringing the confirmed Palestinian death toll to over 41,000. (Al Jazeera) Syrian civil war Iran–Israel conflict during the Syrian civil war At least 25 people are killed and more than 40 others are injured in overnight Israeli airstrikes targeting Iranian research centers in Syria, according to the Syrian Observatory for Human Rights. (The Guardian) (Syriahr) Insurgency in Khyber Pakhtunkhwa Thirteen people are injured when a roadside bomb targets a police vehicle escorting a polio vaccination team in Wana, Khyber Pakhtunkhwa, Pakistan. (Arab News) Kurdistan Workers' Party insurgency The Turkish Ministry of Defense announces that a Turkish soldier was killed in clashes with the Kurdistan Workers' Party in Duhok Governorate, Iraq. (Daily Sabah) Sudanese civil war The Rapid Support Forces renew an assault on the city of Sennar, Sennar State, Sudan, killing at least 31 people and injuring more than 100 others. (Reuters) Disasters and accidents 2024 Brazil wildfires, 2023–2024 South American drought Fifty-nine percent of Brazil's area suffers from significant drought conditions, the worst national drought recorded. These conditions cause historically low Amazon basin levels and are contributing to at least 160,000 wildfires in 2024 that are causing widespread air pollution. (AP) 2024 Pacific typhoon season The death toll from Typhoon Yagi in northern Vietnam increases to more than 64 people, with 24 others still missing. (Al Jazeera) (AP News) Eighteen people are killed and four are missing during floods caused by torrential rains in southern Morocco. Fifty-six homes are destroyed and 110 roads damaged. (Arab News) At least 16 people are killed and 22 others are injured when a bus and a truck collide in Bambey Department, Senegal. (TRT Afrika) At least six people are killed when a boat carrying migrants capsizes off the coast of Senegal over the weekend. (Reuters) International relations Slovakia–Ukraine relations, Far-right politics in Ukraine The Ukrainian Foreign Ministry expresses "disappointment" regarding assertions made by Slovakian Prime Minister Robert Fico that Kyiv should remove "fascist elements" from the Armed Forces of Ukraine, using rhetoric similar to Russian allegations of current neo-Nazism in Ukraine's Azov Brigade. (Reuters) Law and crime Censorship in Nigeria The Nigerian State Security department arrests Joe Ajaero, the leader of the Nigeria Labour Congress, at Nnamdi Azikiwe International Airport in Abuja, Nigeria, days after Ajaero criticised the Nigerian government for increasing gas prices. (DW) Ali Kiba, a Tanzanian official from the opposition party Chadema, who went missing last week, is found dead with signs of beatings and acid poured on his face. (ABC News) Germany's traffic light coalition government announces border restrictions on all its national land borders, including those with other EU nations, for at least six months in order to combat irregular migration from asylum seekers. (Reuters) The exiled National Council of Resistance of Iran claim that its offices in Stockholm, Sweden, were firebombed overnight with Molotov cocktails. The Swedish Police Authority announces that they have opened an investigation into the arson. (Al Arabiya) Forty-seven inmates escape from a maximum security prison in Margibi County, Liberia. (Reuters) Finnish-Canadian sportswear mogul Peter Nygård is sentenced to 11 years in prison for sexual assault. (CBC News) Authorities in Guinea-Bissau say that they have seized more than 2.6 tonnes of cocaine that was found on a plane arriving from Venezuela at Osvaldo Vieira International Airport in Bissau. (BBC News)

---

RD: Friedrich Schorlemmer

Article: Friedrich Schorlemmer (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): ZDF
Credits:

• Updated and nominated by Gerda Arendt (talk · give credit)
• Updated by Grimes2 (talk · give credit)

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

One of the people who made the the Peaceful Revolution in East Germany possible, said the German President. Don't miss the video in the source that shows some key events. - The article was mostly there but too many things were translated that were clearer in German, refs were lost, others needed expansions including finding their titles, - plenty of work, took some time. We added publications, more awards, more obits. Still room for more detail if you have time. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 16:13, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

Comment I like people, who have done so much for peace. Grimes2 (talk) 16:23, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

• Support. Article looks alright to me. Cheers. 🛧Midori No Sora♪🛪 ( ☁＝☁＝✈) 21:32, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

RD: Raja Petra Kamarudin

Article: Raja Petra Kamarudin (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): The Star
Credits:

• Nominated by Tofusaurus (talk · give credit)
• Updated by FarGah1 (talk · give credit)

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Tofusaurus (talk) 03:57, 10 September 2024 (UTC)

• Not Ready. Quite a few sections are unsourced. 🛧Midori No Sora♪🛪 ( ☁＝☁＝✈) 06:51, 10 September 2024 (UTC)

(RD posted) Blurb/RD: James Earl Jones

Article: James Earl Jones (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination
Blurb:  American actor James Earl Jones (pictured) dies at the age of 93 (Post)
News source(s): Variety
Credits:

• Nominated by Masem (talk · give credit)
• Updated by Natg 19 (talk · give credit) and TDKR Chicago 101 (talk · give credit)

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Masem (t) 20:52, 9 September 2024 (UTC)

• Support for RD. Harizotoh9 (talk) 20:53, 9 September 2024 (UTC)

  @Harizotoh9: Is this a "support RD only" or a "support blurb"? Thanks. —Bagumba (talk) 05:47, 11 September 2024 (UTC)

• [1] – Muboshgu (talk) 20:54, 9 September 2024 (UTC)

  Needs some more sources, but shouldn't be too far from ready. – Muboshgu (talk) 21:02, 9 September 2024 (UTC)

• Oppose There are several unreferenced paragraphs. Vacant0 (talk • contribs) 20:56, 9 September 2024 (UTC)
• note article is not yet ready for RD due to several unsourced paragraphs and a few cn's. Also I did not nominate for a blurb as though an actor with a large number of important roles, he did not have the type of impact that someone like Sidney Poitier had to the industry and doesn't met the major figure aspect. (I have a gut feeling this will draw lots of "he's famous/popular so he should be blurbed" type votes so stating my concern for this now) Masem (t) 20:57, 9 September 2024 (UTC)
  • from his lead, "one of the greatest actors in American history" but not a major figure. (eye roll) Kcmastrpc (talk) 21:04, 9 September 2024 (UTC)

    From the source: Alec Baldwin and Close each praised Jones, with Baldwin calling the 80-year-old "one of the greatest actors in American history." One person's opinion is not a consensus. The article's lead should provide some attribution. – Muboshgu (talk) 21:15, 9 September 2024 (UTC)

    Let's be honest and serious, it's not only one person's opinion. "James Earl Jones doesn't get enough credit for being a path-blazer for actors like Denzel Washington who came after him"[2]

    And we will find more of this in countless obits that will follow. BilboBeggins (talk) 21:22, 9 September 2024 (UTC)

    Agreed, though I was being hyperbolic, his influence and prominence both onscreen and offscreen make him suitable for Blurb nomination. Kcmastrpc (talk) 21:23, 9 September 2024 (UTC)

    Which right now, the article lacks any significant discussion of his importance or impact beyond a few statements in the lede. I'd be willing to support a blurb but if only a section that fully goes into that depth with multiple sources on the matter (which may originate from these obits) is included so that these factors are clearly demonstrated rather than hand-waved as "trust me". — Masem (t) 21:27, 9 September 2024 (UTC)

    I would have suggested going with, "Pray that I don't alter the deal further." However, that seems reasonable enough. Kcmastrpc (talk) 21:29, 9 September 2024 (UTC)

    And of course I should add, the quality overall must be fixed. That's a show stopper right there. — Masem (t) 21:36, 9 September 2024 (UTC)

  To say Darth Vader did not have the same impact as someone most people probably don't know is an insult to James Earl Jones. LilianaUwU ^{(talk / contributions)} 22:12, 9 September 2024 (UTC)

  I don't think anyone was even remotely trying to insult JEJ, and I'm struggling to see how anything written above can be construed as such. - SchroCat (talk) 07:55, 10 September 2024 (UTC)

  Darth Vader isnt JEJ, he Voice acted him but Darth Vader is not JEJ so shouldn’t be considered in that regard. 27.96.223.192 (talk) 08:38, 10 September 2024 (UTC)

  Hard to tell that he was a black man under that mask. Perhaps his extensive stage acting made him more notable? 205.239.40.3 (talk) 08:49, 10 September 2024 (UTC)

  It wasn't him under the mask Varoon2542 (talk) 22:40, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

• Support Blurb The citation issues have been cleared up and the article quality improved. JEJ Death and Legacy section outline why this individual is a major figure in his field and how his work is deserving of a blurb. Kcmastrpc (talk) 12:22, 11 September 2024 (UTC)

  @Kcmastrpc: Was this a "support RD only" or "support blurb"? Thanks. —Bagumba (talk) 05:44, 11 September 2024 (UTC)

Updated Kcmastrpc (talk) 12:22, 11 September 2024 (UTC)

• Support Blurb. Obvious blurb. EGOT achiever. Had theatre named after him during his lifetime. Had many iconic roles,had distinguished career on film, TV, and stage. And last but not least, he was Darth Vader, after all. BilboBeggins (talk) 21:17, 9 September 2024 (UTC)
• Support Blurb. EGOT winner and without a doubt he was at the top of his field through his iconic roles and performances beyond film such as in broadway too. Death is making international headlines. However I do believe a legacy section and/or the article needs to address how influential he was in the acting field. TDKR Chicago 101 (talk) 21:20, 9 September 2024 (UTC)
  • Not EGOT, given his Oscar was an honorary one only. - SchroCat (talk) 22:06, 9 September 2024 (UTC)

    Non-competitive EGOTs are still considered one, just not quite the same as the actual thing. The Kip ^(contribs) 22:20, 9 September 2024 (UTC)

• Weak support blurb per BilboBeggins and TDKR, but I won't be unhappy if it's just an RD. The Kip ^(contribs) 21:32, 9 September 2024 (UTC)
• Was he a real actor or did he just do Darth Vader? Thank you. 86.187.239.81 (talk) 21:40, 9 September 2024 (UTC)

  Yes, he was a real actor, he got Tony and Oscar. BilboBeggins (talk) 22:01, 9 September 2024 (UTC)

  Even if he hadn't performed multiple other roles (as you could see even just from the lead of the article), voice actors are (also) considered "real actors". Funcrunch (talk) 23:12, 9 September 2024 (UTC)

• Wait then Support Blurb one the most well known actors. While he is most known for Darth Vader and Mufasa’s voice, he has an incredibly long, extensive, and iconic acting career. Just needs more sourcing and expanding, specifically on his death. Kybrion (talk) 21:54, 9 September 2024 (UTC)
• RD ONLY, when the article is ready. I’m sure we’ll see a Carrie Fisher rerun, with lots of fans voting for a blurb, but there’s no real call for it. - SchroCat (talk) 22:06, 9 September 2024 (UTC)

  Carrie Fisher is not on the scale of being transformative and not of the same level of productiveness and versatility. It is basically her only famous role. BilboBeggins (talk) 05:38, 10 September 2024 (UTC)

  And yet, just like Fisher, we see an influx of fans saying "he was famous!!", "he was Darth Vader!" and wanting a blurb for that reason. People are not given a blurb for being famous or versatile or productive. I see nothing in the article that suggests he was transformative. So we're back to the fanboy cries of "blurb because he was in Star Wars!!" line of voting. - SchroCat (talk) 07:13, 10 September 2024 (UTC)

  The main argument for him being indeed transformative is that he got a theatre named after him during his lifetime. Getting something named after a politician or actor while they are alive is rare. BilboBeggins (talk) 20:18, 10 September 2024 (UTC)

  Thats absolutely no indication of a transformative aspect of his career. Having something named after him isn’t an indication of suitability for a blurb. - SchroCat (talk) 22:23, 10 September 2024 (UTC)

  Yes, just small fry? But, looking ahead... Martinevans123 (talk) 19:23, 11 September 2024 (UTC)

  How was he transformative ? He's a relatively obscure figure outside the US. The world doesn't limit itself to the US Varoon2542 (talk) 22:35, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

• Support blurb once the issues are fixed. I'm not a Star Wars fan, but he was Darth Vader, dammit. LilianaUwU ^{(talk / contributions)} 22:13, 9 September 2024 (UTC)

  Funny, I don’t remember any calls for David Prowse to have a blurb, although he was Darth Vader, dammit. - SchroCat (talk) 22:23, 10 September 2024 (UTC)

• Blurb He is a Black historymaker and one of the most distinguished voices to ever grace the screen and stage. He is an EGOT winner. There is a theatre named after him. He played many more characters beyond his most iconic roles. Rest in peace. -TenorTwelve (talk) 22:17, 9 September 2024 (UTC)

  A black history maker ?

  He's a relatively obscure figure outside the US. Even the voice acting he did was dubbed in local languages Varoon2542 (talk) 22:37, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

• Comment Re: the inevitable discussion over whether Star Wars actors should be blurbed , I think the following living or recently deceased are blurbable: George Lucas, James Earl Jones, and Samuel L Jackson. Harrison Ford is debatable/possible, but not as certain. Possibly Warwick Davis for representation for people with Dwarfism. Not as much for other folks (though some are debatable). The standard I would set for blurbing Star Wars actors is 1. Are they a history-maker? 2. How much have they contributed to the acting/directing field outside of Star Wars, such as other franchises or major films. James Earl Jones fits both of these. This should be an easy decision to blurb. -TenorTwelve (talk) 22:34, 9 September 2024 (UTC)

  I'm surprised that you put Harrison Ford as "debatable/possible", but are certain about Samuel L. Jackson. Ford not only was Han Solo but was the lead roles in the Indiana Jones and Blade Runner series, not to mention starring in The Fugitive and Air Force One. Nonetheless, support blurb when ready. Natg 19 (talk) 22:43, 9 September 2024 (UTC)

  There is zero reason to make any assumption that people that have starred in Star Wars should automatically be consdiered for blurbs. That's not a criteria at all. Having starred in Star Wars may have launched major careers (like Ford or Hamill), or may have cemented their place as an actor, but it is absolutely wrong to claim being in Star Wars is important enough. We're not TV Tropes or a pop culture musuem, we are an encyclopedia. — Masem (t) 02:14, 10 September 2024 (UTC)

• Support blurb - I may be a bit biased as a Star Was fan, but Jones had one of the most recognizable voices in cinematic history. - ZLEA _T\^C 22:39, 9 September 2024 (UTC)
• Oppose blurb There’s no legacy section that explains why he was transformative in his field (Ismail Kadare’s dismissal earlier this year raised the bar for a blurb).--Kiril Simeonovski (talk) 22:42, 9 September 2024 (UTC)
• Strong oppose blurb old man dies. Death not notable as an event. This is what the RD line is for, people This post was made by orbitalbuzzsaw gang (talk) 22:43, 9 September 2024 (UTC)

  This is not true. The death of major figures may merit a blurb per WP:ITNRDBLURB. Whether Jones is a "major figure" or not is debatable, but there is no blanket prohibition against death blurbs for "old people dying". Natg 19 (talk) 22:47, 9 September 2024 (UTC)

• Support blurb when the article is ready. Not many people are recognized all over the world by their voice alone, this makes him unique. Cart (talk) 22:52, 9 September 2024 (UTC)
• RD only. Very notable actor, but not on par with a world leader. 31.44.224.222 (talk) 23:04, 9 September 2024 (UTC)
• Support blurb once any remaining article issues are cleaned up. Highly notable and recognizable, winner of multiple major awards across stage and screen; not just known for his unique deep voice. Funcrunch (talk) 23:10, 9 September 2024 (UTC)
• Support blurb, best EGOT. Hyperbolick (talk) 23:25, 9 September 2024 (UTC)
• Oppose blurb — Not significant enough. elijahpepe@wikipedia (he/him) 23:30, 9 September 2024 (UTC)
• Support blurb After cleanup. Promethean (talk) 23:43, 9 September 2024 (UTC)
• Blurbing support. Worldwide household name. Who doesn't know Darth Vader??? Kasperquickly (talk) 00:43, 10 September 2024 (UTC)
• Support Article is of sufficient quality for RD. --MtPenguinMonster (talk) 00:49, 10 September 2024 (UTC)

  @MtPenguinMonster: Is this a "support RD only" or a "support blurb"? Thanks. —Bagumba (talk) 05:46, 11 September 2024 (UTC)

  Support RD, neutral on blurb. --MtPenguinMonster (talk) 06:23, 11 September 2024 (UTC)

• Support blurb per above. Very well-known roles, EGOT, household name and recognizable voice, etc. Davey2116 (talk) 00:50, 10 September 2024 (UTC)
• Support RD, Oppose blurb because he's notable in cinema, but not worldwide. JohnAdams1800 (talk) 00:56, 10 September 2024 (UTC)
• Support RD, Oppose blurb per WP:OLDMANDIES. Jones was not superstar level in the US and is barely known outside of the US. —  AjaxSmack  01:08, 10 September 2024 (UTC)
• Support Blurb I'm a bit surprised his notability is even being debated. Even discounting his roles as Darth Vader and Mufasa, the guy had a whole slew of other roles such that it was separated into its own list article. — Gestrid (talk) 01:35, 10 September 2024 (UTC)
  • Notability is not in question. But he is a great figure, that's the debate. We normally do not consider aspects like fame or popularity in posting blurbs, since that is favoritism towards Western and English topics, though if that fame/popularity can be demonstrated as being part of a great figure, great. — Masem (t) 01:59, 10 September 2024 (UTC)
• Support Blurb, since I would argue that his notability alone, given his various prominent, world-known roles (i.e. Darth Vader, Mufasa, etc.), would merit a blurb. The referencing issue seems to have been sorted out as well given the voters' shift from issues of referencing to issues of notability. PootisHeavy (talk) 02:01, 10 September 2024 (UTC)
  • Sourcing is better than when I posted the nomination but it is still missing citations and has CN tags throughout. Its not yet ready for an RD posting, much less a blurb. — Masem (t) 02:09, 10 September 2024 (UTC)
• Support blurb, Has starred in prominent films notably Coming to America that has been a Box Office seller including voice overs in The Lion King, documentaries and Darth Vader in Star Wars.Kampolama(talk) 04:34, 10 September 2024 (UTC)
• EGOT club member, easy choice for blurb (w/ usual conditional re article quality). WP:ITN: If the person's death itself is newsworthy for either the manner of death or the newsworthy reaction to it, it may merit a blurb. "Front page" of CNN NYT NBC News BBC, at quick glance. --Slowking Man (talk) 03:22, 10 September 2024 (UTC)
• Support blurb. He is well-known outside the US and not only within it, and should be an obvious case of WP:ITNRDBLURB as a major figure (definitely not another WP:OLDMANDIES as claimed above), there are few people who wouldn't recognise his voice or characters; only 2 cn tags remaining which will likely be resolved and should not be barrier to posting. Happily888 (talk) 03:54, 10 September 2024 (UTC)
• Not Quite Ready A handful of CN tags. Support Blurb once up to scratch. 1 Acadamy Award, 3 Emmys, a Golden Globe, a Grammy, a SAG, and 3 Tonys plus a plethora of second tier awards. That is more than enough for a blurb. -Ad Orientem (talk) 04:13, 10 September 2024 (UTC)

  Not a serving head of state/government. Manner of death not notable. ITN items should be events in their own right This post was made by orbitalbuzzsaw gang (talk) 04:48, 10 September 2024 (UTC)

• Support Blurb a very widely known actor/performer even in the counties outside of the anglosphere. One of only 27 people to ever EGOT, that makes quite notable. However, there are some cn tags that needs to be resolved before posting this. ਪ੍ਰਿੰਸ ਆਫ਼ ਪੰਜਾਬ ^{(PrinceofPunjab | ਗੱਲਬਾਤ)} 04:58, 10 September 2024 (UTC)
• Comment Appears that the quality issues have been addressed in terms of citation tags/unsourced statements. --TDKR Chicago 101 (talk) 05:16, 10 September 2024 (UTC)
• Support blurb: One of the most iconic actors. Connor Behan (talk) 05:25, 10 September 2024 (UTC)
• Marking as Ready. Natg 19 (talk) 05:48, 10 September 2024 (UTC)
• Support for RD. Not totally convinced by the WP:ITNRDBLURB case -- his life was clearly the main story here, and while Darth Vader is universally known, I'd need more convincing that his voice actor qualifies as such a major figure. I would certainly struggle to list JEJ as (for example) one of the greatest actors of all time/the twentieth century or so on, despite being a much beloved figure. Edit: to make it formal, I would oppose blurb.UndercoverClassicist ^T·C 06:40, 10 September 2024 (UTC)
• Support Blurb. Per most of the above. Legendary actor with dozens of award received and as the voice actor for Darth Vader. 🛧Midori No Sora♪🛪 ( ☁＝☁＝✈) 06:46, 10 September 2024 (UTC)
• Oppose Blurb I think he was a high-profile actor with a commanding presence. I don’t think he was a transformative force in acting. The article does not show that he was. I think a lot of people are mentioning that he played Darth Vader, or that he had lots of film roles, but not explaining how that makes his death blurb material. I have to wonder what this discussion would look like without the Star Wars factor - Star Wars is a phenomenon bound to appeal to Wikipedians. There are a lot of top-level theatre actors who have played high profile roles in films - are we going to blurb all of them? humbledaisy 07:15, 10 September 2024 (UTC)~

  Per the article, Jones has been recognised as an early pioneer in African Americans in stage and television, with his career spanning back to the prejudiced years of 1965. This take does speak to notability outside of his various roles and I don't think could be said for many actors. Promethean (talk) 12:24, 10 September 2024 (UTC)

• Support blurb per above. A popular actor with EGOT. LiamKorda 09:05, 10 September 2024 (UTC)
  • all EGOT winners are popular in some sense. What is it that makes James Earl Jones transformative and more deserving of a blurb than most popular actors? Humbledaisy (talk) 09:32, 10 September 2024 (UTC)
    • Yes. Hyperbolick (talk) 10:45, 10 September 2024 (UTC)
      • I'm asking what the rationale is. What is it that lifts James Earl Jones above the likes of Kirk Douglas, another American actor who had a long career with various awards and died at a very advanced age, or Michael Gambon, another veteran who was not a consistent leading man but is world-famous for playing a central character in a genre film franchise? I haven't seen anyone make a case - people are treating this as if it's a dead cert. Humbledaisy (talk) 11:12, 10 September 2024 (UTC)
• Oppose Blurb. Not transformative. (Also not well known in UK apart from Star Wars). Martinevans123 (talk) 09:42, 10 September 2024 (UTC)
• Support blurb His article got over a million readers yesterday and that's a fairly reliable rule of thumb for whether someone has sufficient fame to get a blurb. Andrew🐉(talk) 10:16, 10 September 2024 (UTC)

Extended discussion of the significance of such statistics

One wonders what difference posting to Main page will cause to number of views? What's the usual effect? Thanks. Martinevans123 (talk) 10:28, 10 September 2024 (UTC) For one RD post, Eric Sievers, he died on April 10, was posted to RD on April 14, and received ~7,000 more views that day after trending down the previous days.[3] Not sure about the effect of a blurb, or a pictured blurb. —Bagumba (talk) 10:54, 10 September 2024 (UTC) Many thanks. I was thinking more of someone like this. Martinevans123 (talk) 11:13, 10 September 2024 (UTC) That's harder to gauge when there's 100s of thousands of views to know what's the "natural" traffic vs. the RD effect. There's the natural dropoff of views with each passing day. With a less popular one like Sievers, it's easy to see the bump when it took a few days to post. —Bagumba (talk) 12:30, 10 September 2024 (UTC) Actually, there's click data for Wikipedia at m:Research:Wikipedia_clickstream. In the month of June, it shows Main_Page Donald_Sutherland other 44467. **If** I'm reading it correctly, there was 44,467 clicks from the Main Page to Sutherland's page, presumably all from the RD post. It was up for ~40 hours, which works out to ~27,000 views/day. —Bagumba (talk) 13:04, 10 September 2024 (UTC) Thanks for discovering this as it's another good source of evidence. Trying this out, I looked at July's stats. For a given article, you can see where the traffic came from. The following is a list of prominent RD/blurbs during July and the percentage of traffic that came from the main page, i.e. ITN. Toumani Diabaté = 42% Nguyễn Phú Trọng = 31% (the one person that got a blurb) Ray Reardon = 14% John Mayall = 7.8% Edna O'Brien = 2.96% Shelley Duvall = 1.87% Bob Newhart = 0.99% William Calley = 0.98% Richard Simmons = 0.73% Prince Michael of Greece and Denmark = 0.55% So, in most such cases, it appears that ITN has little effect in driving traffic. From the comparative data, it seems that the Deaths in July 2024 often drove more traffic. Andrew🐉(talk) 17:20, 10 September 2024 (UTC) The caveat is that those are monthly totals, and an items says on RD for say 1–3 days out of 30, and popular people obviously get more traffic independent of RD. But the beauty and curse of statistics is that small percentages of a large volume is still thousands or tens of thousands of clicks. For example, depending on the desired narrative, a company of 10,000 that laid off 100 people can said to have "only had a 1% reduction" vs "terminated 100 workers". —Bagumba (talk) 01:13, 11 September 2024 (UTC) Indeed. When using statistics, what you want are the big numbers, not the small ones. By looking at our readership stats, you can see whether a story is attracting millions of views or just a few thousand. This seems to be a more objective measure than a poll of the tiny number of editors that show up here. Andrew🐉(talk) 06:55, 11 September 2024 (UTC) We do not care about page views here, again. Nor are page views any indication about whether we should post a blurb (that would make it a popularity game and that's a disservice to the main page) — Masem (t) 11:57, 10 September 2024 (UTC) So if someone dies Sunday and their page gets 100,000 views on Monday and Tuesday... then their RD gets posted to Main page on Wednesday, and the page gets 50,000 views for the rest of the week.... That's all just irrelevant? ITN/RD is still worth all the effort? (I guess this question should really be discussed at ITN Talk). Thanks. Martinevans123 (talk) 12:04, 10 September 2024 (UTC) If that were the case, then we'd close blurbs and RDs within 2 days because what's the point then? We'd like to make sure things are timely, but we also need to make sure all aspects are met before posting, and thus we have the 7 day period for candidates to be considered. We're not here to make sure the most popular news stories are being pushed to the ITN box, but to showcase quality articles that are in the news, if that happens to be someone popular that brings a lot of views from the main page, great, but its by no means any rational we have to post something. Consider that probably the bulk of those million views for JEJ were well before RD was posted, so it is not like readers cannot find their way to that article without ITN's help. Masem (t) 12:16, 10 September 2024 (UTC) We might close them if monitoring of page views was an agreed part of the process? Martinevans123 (talk) 12:22, 10 September 2024 (UTC) We shouldn't be worried at all about page views; certainly none of the other Main Page sections worry about this. We want to feature any quality WP content - with the situation that it should have been in the news recently (7 days). That's it. Whether that drives people to read those articles is out of our control once posted, but we do know there's typically a bump, however small, because of being shown on the main page, means that we're meeting our job. Hence why aspects like popularity or page views should not be any type of driver for posting an item, not to mention the general aspect of fighting systematic bias. Masem (t) 12:43, 10 September 2024 (UTC) Is there systematic bias for posting American actors with whom UK editors are largely unfamiliar? Thanks. Martinevans123 (talk) 12:58, 10 September 2024 (UTC) The systematic bias is two part here, one being American, and two being a celebrity, both areas where there is disproportionate news coverage. It's why this blurb and several of the comments make it feel like a popularity contest. We should worry about "not famous in country X" comments, since that type of argument is discouraged in addition to our goal of trying to show a diverse array of topics (it's like that French actor from a few weeks ago, perhaps only a household name in France but demonstrated all the right factors for blurb posting, just never got quality improved) Masem (t) 13:29, 10 September 2024 (UTC) No, I meant simply that because there are more American !voters here, American actors will tend to get more support for a blurb. Thanks. Martinevans123 (talk) 13:34, 10 September 2024 (UTC) Which is still a systematic bias we should try to overcome. Masem (t) 13:37, 10 September 2024 (UTC) (not that editors ever have to disclose their nationality; and I personally have no idea of the percentage nationality split between all editors) Martinevans123 (talk) 13:39, 10 September 2024 (UTC) No, there is hardly any. We didn't post blurbs even of such well-known actors as Kirk Douglas, Donald Sutherland, William Hurt, Gena Rowlands, Lauren Bacall, Eli Wallach, Harry Dean Stanton, Louis Gosset, Jr., Martin Landau. Except Dean Stanton all actors in the list had an Oscar. BilboBeggins (talk) 16:26, 10 September 2024 (UTC)

• Note that, on day 2, the readership of his article has gone up and is still over a million. This will not be because of the RD posting, which will have barely made the needle twitch. It's more likely due to the impact of tributes and follow-ups across the global media which tend to follow the death of a major figure. You don't usually see this pattern for ordinary deaths which typically have an initial spike and then a steep decline.

And note that these numbers are huge compared to everything else on Wikipedia. If you look at the top read articles, then Jones is way out in front with 1.35 million while the #2 is Cecilia Hart with just 197K. And why is she #2? That's because she was Jones' wife! You have to go to #3 to find a different topic and that just got 166K views.

Andrew🐉(talk) 07:15, 11 September 2024 (UTC)

• RD posted Blurb discussion can continue.—Bagumba (talk) 11:00, 10 September 2024 (UTC)
• Oppose blurb Decent actor? Yes. Transformative? No. I really don't like to criticise other editor's reasoning, but let's be clear here - Kirk Douglas didn't get a blurb because "old man dies". Is Jones on a higher level? I really don't want to mention the Carrie Fisher effect here, but - oops, sorry. But really, how many non-Star Wars fans outside the US would even know who he was? Black Kite (talk) 12:16, 10 September 2024 (UTC)

  I'd agree, except for the fact that his career stems back to 1965 and, per the article, he's been recognised as a pioneer for African Americans in stage and film. Promethean (talk) 12:27, 10 September 2024 (UTC)

  He lived a long life and continued to work into his dotage. I don't think that's all that unusual when it comes to notable film actors. There are hundreds of notable screen stars working right now whose careers span 50+ years. Donald Sutherland's career stretched back to the 1960s too but it didn't make him blurb-worthy. James Earl Jones' screen career did start during the civil rights era in the United States, but I don't think it's enough. In contrast to Sidney Poitier (whose death we blurbed), he was not a notable star at that time, he wasn't closely associated with activism and he isn't known for any major firsts as an African-American actor. Humbledaisy (talk) 12:42, 10 September 2024 (UTC)

  He was a second Black actor go get nominated for Oscar. BilboBeggins (talk) 20:21, 10 September 2024 (UTC)

  Well yes, that's my point exactly - not a first. Humbledaisy (talk) 15:02, 11 September 2024 (UTC)

  The changes do not happen immediately, he can be regarded as first Black actor to have achieved that much success on stage. And he was active at the same time as Poitier, so they both contributed. BilboBeggins (talk) 19:13, 11 September 2024 (UTC)

  Loads of actors have careers of many decades, I'm not seeing that as something blurb-worthy. And "being a pioneer for African Americans" is sourced to an obituary. I'd be far more likely to take that seriously if I could see RS saying that from when he was still alive. Black Kite (talk) 14:43, 10 September 2024 (UTC)

  In a 1998 interview, [Denzel] Washington said, “There weren’t a lot of serious Black actors for us to emulate, to follow, to admire. There was Sidney [Poitier]; it was James Earl Jones on stage. That’s what I remember.”[4]

  Washington said this in 1998, long before 2024. BilboBeggins (talk) 20:37, 10 September 2024 (UTC)

  The thing is that, Star Wars is worlwide phenomenon, and the set of Non-Star Wars fans is not large, even outside of US. And the set of people who don't know about Star Wars is even smaller. There will be few people who don't know who Dart Vader is. BilboBeggins (talk) 16:21, 10 September 2024 (UTC)

• Support blurb EGOT recipient is a very rare achievement and signifies the pinnacle of the entertainment industry. In addition, the subject is known for portraying several iconic characters that are universally known worldwide. Blurb is warranted.
  RachelTensions (talk) 13:32, 10 September 2024 (UTC)
  • It represents the pinnacle of the *American* entertainment industry and that alone. Humbledaisy (talk) 15:31, 11 September 2024 (UTC)
• A little late to the party here, but support blurb - the man was/is a household name with several worldwide famous roles and characters under his belt. He's extremely well known not only in the acting scene, but in popular culture overall. Rest in peace. - Bucket of sulfuric acid (talk | contribs) 13:49, 10 September 2024 (UTC)
  • I can assure you that Jones was definitely not a household name, at least outside the USA. Black Kite (talk) 14:44, 10 September 2024 (UTC)
  • I think what User:Masem said earlier applies here; "We're not TV Tropes or a pop culture musuem, we are an encyclopedia". JEJ was the voice of a very well-known character in popular culture. He wasn't a transformative figure in acting and he wasn't among the best-known and most globally significant actors of his generation. Humbledaisy (talk) 15:41, 10 September 2024 (UTC)
• Oppose blurb he wasn't Olivier. Sheila1988 (talk) 15:45, 10 September 2024 (UTC)

  He was a Shakespearean actor and won an award for playing Othello, just like Olivier. What's the difference? Andrew🐉(talk) 17:09, 10 September 2024 (UTC)

  Olivier was white? (until be blacked up, of course)... Martinevans123 (talk) 17:23, 10 September 2024 (UTC)

  What a trite question. Olivier was one of three who dominated British stage acting in the C20th, before moving into theatre management by setting up and running the National Theatre. That’s transformation and a good reason for a blurb, not just for being famous because he voiced Darth Vader. - SchroCat (talk) 18:36, 10 September 2024 (UTC)

• Oppose blurb. RD is more than enough here we go again. He was a very popular actor, but not transformative, he did not mark a milestone in the history of American entertainment. Wikipedia is an encyclopedia, not the New York Times. _-_Alsor (talk) 17:26, 10 September 2024 (UTC)

  What does "transformative" mean? Who is an example of a "transformative" actor, or someone who marked a milestone? Natg 19 (talk) 17:46, 10 September 2024 (UTC)

  Laurence Olivier mentioned in the comment just above. —  AjaxSmack  19:28, 10 September 2024 (UTC)

  Besides the fact that we aren't supposed to be doing x vs y arguments for death blurbs, why exactly was Olivier so much more important than Jones? DarkSide830 (talk) 19:46, 10 September 2024 (UTC)

  Again, see the comments above about one being transformative and the other not. - SchroCat (talk) 22:26, 10 September 2024 (UTC)

  You seem to have explained why Olivier was noteworthy enough, but reducing Jones's impact to one acting credit seems to almost completely diminish his larger body of work. DarkSide830 (talk) 22:49, 10 September 2024 (UTC)

  I have done nothing of the sort. A number of people voting for a blurb have done exactly that, ironically enough. - SchroCat (talk) 04:29, 11 September 2024 (UTC)

  That's...exactly what you said in response to the previous vote. You said Jones was notable explicitly just because he voiced Vader. DarkSide830 (talk) 18:06, 11 September 2024 (UTC)

  ”You said Jones was notable explicitly just because he voiced Vader”: that’s just not true. JEJ was a notable actor because of his entire career (that’s just obvious); it’s an outright lie to say I have only said he was notable because he played Vader. - SchroCat (talk) 18:54, 11 September 2024 (UTC)

  1 Acadamy Award, 3 Emmys, a Golden Globe, a Grammy, a SAG, and 3 Tonys plus a plethora of second tier awards. I'd say he was in the same league as Olivier. -Ad Orientem (talk) 23:36, 10 September 2024 (UTC)

  Then you don’t understand what Olivier’s impact was. Aside from dominating the British stage for much of the twentieth century, he was a formidable producer and director. He worked to set up the National Theatre and then ran in, and completely changed theatre in the UK. That’s what a transformative figure does. I see nothing in JEJ’s article that suggests he was transformative. - SchroCat (talk) 04:29, 11 September 2024 (UTC)

• Support Blurb. Titan in his field, long career with an EGOT to boot. You want transformative? How about the fame he got from one of the most famous VA roles ever as Vader? Probably one of the first to achieve that level of fame in an off-screen acting role. Seems pretty slam-dunk to me. DarkSide830 (talk) 19:27, 10 September 2024 (UTC)

  • Oppose blurb Very famous for his voice acting roles of Mufasa and Darth Vader but was not transformative in his field.

  Noah, BSBA^Talk 22:48, 10 September 2024 (UTC)

• Support Blurb Anyone with an EGOT merits serious consideration. Even if his "O" in the EGOT was noncompetitive, the fact that he voiced Darth Vader and had notable roles in critically acclaimed films such as Field of Dreams, The Lion King and Cry, the Beloved Country puts him over the top for me. --Pats2017 (talk) 00:53, 11 September 2024 (UTC)
• Leaning support blurb. I just wanted to comment that I don't think WP:OLDMANDIES is applicable here. While the subject was indeed "old", he was not long-retired and out of the spotlight. He appeared in both live-action and voice roles in the 2020s, and his voice continues to be used by an agreement reached before his death. I also do think that his success as an American black actor beginning in the 1960s is inherently more transformative than that of non-minority actors in the same time period. BD2412 T 03:34, 11 September 2024 (UTC)
• Support blurb - This is not about his two widely-known voice acting roles. This is about a long and distinguished career on stage and screen, his role as a trailblazer for African-American actors (qv Denzel quote above), and his overall stature in the field. GenevieveDEon (talk) 08:49, 11 September 2024 (UTC)
• Oppose blurb not even close to being in the same league as Alain Delon, whom we did not post. So no, definitely not blurb worthy. 2A02:8071:6362:54A0:E829:76AA:FD43:F219 (talk) 11:02, 11 September 2024 (UTC)

  Main reason why Alain Delon was not blurbed was due to the article quality being bad/not in good enough shape for posting to be fair. Jones's article is in better quality. Also not a fan of "x didn't get blurbed so neither should y" rationale. TDKR Chicago 101 (talk) 12:29, 11 September 2024 (UTC)

  There was consensus leaning to not blurbing Delon back then and there is consensus leaning to blurbing James Earl Jones now.

  It's not that I agreed with the arguments for not blurbing Delon, because there was evidence of him being transformative in the article, but the discussion on that ended and the main problem was that it couldn't even be posted to RD. BilboBeggins (talk) 14:46, 11 September 2024 (UTC)

• Well, if this is going to end up being blurbed and we are going to make the Carrie Fisher mistake a second time, does anyone want to explain the rationale? Most of the votes here are just "he was Darth Vader, duh!" or "He was very famous" and those strike me as very weak arguments. I've seen very little genuine rationale for a blurb in this discussion aside from the Denzel Washington quote. That doesn't seem enough - it could be said of several other actors, more strongly Sidney Poitier who we previously blurbed - and, as I mentioned before, JEJ was not a notable star during the Civil Rights era, he wasn't closely associated with civil rights or activism and he isn't known for any major firsts as an African-American actor. Humbledaisy (talk) 15:42, 11 September 2024 (UTC)

  There's a similar Denzel quote already in the article. Not sure which is the more notable. Martinevans123 (talk) 16:40, 11 September 2024 (UTC)

  The mistake will be not to blurb him.

  Could you give rationale why Poitier was bigger than Janes Earl Jone? In last twenty years of his life Poitier was not active except for occasional Oscar ceremony appearances. And before that his only significant, or blockbuster role in another twenty years or so was being third-billed role in Jackal.

  One of the rationale was that he got theatre named during his lifetime. BilboBeggins (talk) 19:17, 11 September 2024 (UTC)

  “If you were an actor or aspired to be an actor, if you pounded the payment in these streets looks for jobs, one of the standards we always had was to be a James Earl Jones," — this is from no other than Samuel L. Jackson.

  “The first play that I saw was ‘Fences,’” said Tony-winning director Kenny Leon of Jones’ performance in Wilson’s seminal American play. “I was a country boy from Tallahassee, Florida, came here as a National Endowment for the Arts fellow, and I saw ‘Fences.’ It changed the directory of my professional life.”

  "Of the theater luminaries in attendance, including Brian Stokes Mitchell, LaChanze, Norm Lewis and playwright Suzan-Lori Parks, many reflected on Jones’ indelible influence on their careers" — from Variety on opening of the theatre [5]. BilboBeggins (talk) 19:22, 11 September 2024 (UTC)

• After bringing this up with Tone, who previously closed it, I'm BOLDly re-opening this nom. Just believe it was closed a tad early and do believe we may have been close to consensus with a little more debate. [Admins, feel free to smite me for doing this as an involved editor, but I really believe more dicsussion is worthwhile. DarkSide830 (talk) 15:13, 12 September 2024 (UTC)
• Post-reopening support + blurb Globally known voice. Obviously, we would prefer not to be in touch with the rest of the world, but we can't always get it our own navel-gazing way. SerialNumber54129 16:38, 12 September 2024 (UTC)
• Support blurb: Any EGOT-winning actor who has married two women who played Desdemona to his Othello deserves a blurb. This could be an ITN/R rule. :) -- SashiRolls ^{🌿 · 🍥} 17:44, 12 September 2024 (UTC)
• Support blurb His roles in Star Wars, Field of Dreams & The Lion King, his awards & what’s written in the “Death and legacy” section make me think he merits a blurb. Blaylockjam10 (talk) 20:52, 12 September 2024 (UTC)
• Oppose blurb His voice is recognisable in the English speaking world but he was dubbed in local languages albeit in his style. Otherwise, his name and identity are relatively obscur. This is not a fan page
• First of all, I'm happy to see this discussion was reopened. I think it was a very poor decision to close it.

Going through the discussion, I see many reasons to blurb, including:

1) Major/iconic figure in the field. 2) EGOT recipient (even though one of his awards was noncompetitive, such recipients are still generally recognized as having an EGOT). 3) Pioneer for the Black community in acting. 4) Death is making international headlines. 5) Internationally recognizable voice 6) He was Darth Vader

I don't see the last two arguments as valid; they hinge on one or two roles (Vader & CNN bumper voice) so I'm discounting their weight

Reasons opposed to blurbing:

1) Not significant/transformative enough 2) Poitier was an earlier pioneer--I can see a case for these. 3) He's not worldwide--somewhat of a stretch considering the reach of the Star Wars franchise & CNN but I'll concede it. 4) Not on par with a world leader 5) We're an encyclopedia, not The New York Times 6) We're not a fan page These are weak rationales. We've always blurbed the occasional entertainer, all encyclopedias include articles on cultural/entertainment figures, and despite what some people seem to think we've never limited death blurbs to world leaders. 7) He's only known for Vader. Not true, he won many awards for other roles. 8) If we didn't blurb X, then we shouldn't blurb James Earl Jones. Not necessarily true. We've made poor decisions not to blurb someone in the past; doesn't mean we should repeat the mistake.

Either way, whether counting all !votes (by my count 36-18 in favor of blurbing) or just the votes that are more compelling arguments (33-10 for a blurb), there's a supermajority of at least 2-1 to blurb James Earl Jones. While I know there's no "hard number" for making a determination, this certainly seems to me like a consensus to blurb. --Pats2017 (talk) 01:34, 13 September 2024 (UTC)

September 8

Portal:Current events/2024 September 8

September 8, 2024 (2024-09-08) (Sunday) Armed conflicts and attacks Russian invasion of Ukraine Pokrovsk offensive Russia formally claims control of Novohrodivka, Donetsk Oblast, twelve kilometers (seven miles) from the strategically important Ukrainian logistical hub city Pokrovsk. (Reuters) War in Afghanistan Fall of Kabul, 2020–2021 U.S. troop withdrawal from Afghanistan Republicans in the U.S. House of Representatives Foreign Affairs Committee release a report criticizing U.S. President Joe Biden for his handling of the withdrawal of American forces from Afghanistan. (The Hill) Israel–Hezbollah conflict The Israeli military says that several Hezbollah militants were killed in airstrikes on Hezbollah targets in southern Lebanon. (Al Jazeera) Syrian civil war Israel launches several airstrikes in central Syria, targeting the Tartus and Hama governorates. (CNN) Sudanese civil war The World Health Organization reports that the death toll from the civil war in Sudan has increased to more than 20,000 people. (AP) Arts and culture 76th Primetime Creative Arts Emmy Awards American historical drama television series Shōgun wins a record 14 Emmys at the 2024 Creative Arts Emmy Awards, the most won for any single season. (AP) Disasters and accidents Wildfires in the United States during 2024 Over 11,000 people are evacuated in San Bernardino County, California, United States, as the Line Fire quadruples in size to over 27 sq mi (17,000 acres). (The New York Times) (BBC News) Forty-eight people and 50 cattle are killed in an explosion caused by a collision between a fuel tanker and a truck in Agaie, Niger State, Nigeria. (AP) Fourteen people are killed and another person is injured when a bus crashes on a highway between Aden and Taiz in Yemen. (AP) Law and crime 2024 Allenby Bridge shooting Three Israeli civilians are killed in a shooting at the Allenby Bridge on the Israel–Jordan border. (Reuters) Kingdom of Jesus Christ compound standoff Kingdom of Jesus Christ pastor Apollo Quiboloy, who is charged with sex trafficking, is arrested amid a standoff between the police and members of the church at the church's headquarters in Davao City, Philippines. (Al Jazeera) Nine people, including El Salvador's National Civil Police chief Mauricio Arriaza Chicas and a fraud suspect, are killed during a helicopter crash while being en route to San Salvador. The crash is considered to be intentional. All flags on government buildings will be flown half-mast for three days. (BBC) Politics and elections 2024 Algerian presidential election Incumbent President of Algeria Abdelmadjid Tebboune is re-elected for his second term with 95% of the vote. (Al Jazeera) 2024 Venezuelan political crisis Venezuelan opposition leader Edmundo González flees Venezuela to seek political asylum in Spain. The Spanish government says that González left Venezuela on a Spanish Air Force plane at his own request. (BBC News) Sports 2024 Summer Paralympics Thailand at the 2024 Summer Paralympics, Wheelchair fencing at the Summer Paralympics Thai wheelchair fencer Saysunee Jana becomes the first female wheelchair fencer, and the second overall, to win gold medals in all three fencing disciplines, épée, foil, and sabre. (Bangkok Post) 2024 US Open In tennis, Jannik Sinner defeats Taylor Fritz in the final of the US Open Men's singles tournament to win his first US Open title ever and his second Grand Slam title overall. Sinner is also the first Italian man to ever win the US Open. (CNN)

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RD: Ben Thapa

Article: Ben Thapa (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Telegraph, the Independent, RTE, Metro
Credits:

• Nominated by Ollieisanerd (talk · give credit)
• Created by Carly1710 (talk · give credit)
• Updated by Cleanupbabe (talk · give credit)

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: English singer, member of G4. Article looks adequate. Ollieisanerd (talk • contribs) 15:50, 10 September 2024 (UTC)

Support: article looks OK; Metro isn't a great source for notability/news coverage but also reported in Telegraph, the Independent and RTE. UndercoverClassicist ^T·C 16:29, 10 September 2024 (UTC)

RD: Ed Kranepool

Article: Ed Kranepool (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): CBS Sports, AP News
Credits:

• Nominated by 240F:7A:6253:1:6C33:5504:7A1B:88BA (talk · give credit)
• Updated by Rlendog (talk · give credit)

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Former first baseman for the New York Mets. 240F:7A:6253:1:6C33:5504:7A1B:88BA (talk) 02:50, 10 September 2024 (UTC)

• Not Ready. For the usual reason. 🛧Midori No Sora♪🛪 ( ☁＝☁＝✈) 06:54, 10 September 2024 (UTC)

(Posted) RD: Ana Gervasi

Article: Ana Gervasi (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Infobae
Credits:

• Nominated by TDKR Chicago 101 (talk · give credit)
• Updated by Strattonsmith (talk · give credit)

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Article updated and well sourced --TDKR Chicago 101 (talk) 09:19, 9 September 2024 (UTC)

Support article is in a good enough shape. ਪ੍ਰਿੰਸ ਆਫ਼ ਪੰਜਾਬ ^{(PrinceofPunjab | ਗੱਲਬਾਤ)} 11:00, 9 September 2024 (UTC)

• Support Short, but good enough. Grimes2 (talk) 11:03, 9 September 2024 (UTC)
• Not ready: Biography has no citation for her birth date or location. Ideally there should be an early life section. Flibirigit (talk) 13:26, 9 September 2024 (UTC)

  @Flibirigit: This information was not there when I nominated this article. I've removed any unsourced information as I myself did research to find a reliable source to confirm birthplace and birth date to no avail. TDKR Chicago 101 (talk) 15:26, 9 September 2024 (UTC)

• Posted Death date properly marked as "circa" since exact date not specified.—Bagumba (talk) 07:15, 10 September 2024 (UTC)

US Open Tennis

Article: Jannik Sinner (talk · history · tag)
Blurb: ​ In tennis, Jannik Sinner (men's singles) and Aryna Sabalenka (women's singles) win the 2024 US Open. (Post)
News source(s): CNN, CNN (for Sabalenka)
Credits:

• Nominated by UndercoverClassicist (talk · give credit)

The nominated event is listed on WP:ITN/R, so each occurrence is presumed to be important enough to post. Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article and update meet WP:ITNCRIT, not the significance.

Both articles are GAs, and US Open wins (men's and women's posted together) are covered by ITNR. Not sure how to do it with two pictures -- I assume in practice we would alternate them? UndercoverClassicist ^T·C 06:19, 9 September 2024 (UTC)

In practice, both images will be combined into one, and the combined one will be used. – robertsky (talk) 07:56, 9 September 2024 (UTC)

• Oppose. The article for this news story and the ITN/R candodate is not the bios of the winners, but the tournament article 2024 US Open (tennis). And this is not remotely up to scratch. No prose summaries of the events at all.  — Amakuru (talk) 09:15, 9 September 2024 (UTC)

  Obviously we should do more work on the U.S. Open article itself, but the fact that we have not one but both of the winners' articles at GA status means I'd love if we could find a way to highlight them as well. DecafPotato (talk) 09:51, 9 September 2024 (UTC)

• Oppose the WP:ITNR item is the event 2024 US Open (tennis), and that article is nowhere near WP:ITNQUALITY. It needs a substantial amount of prose added to it before meeting ITNQUALITY. The 2 player articles have only a few sentences about this tournament, and so should not be used as the bold links in order to circumnavigate the inadequacy of the 2024 US Open (tennis) article, and the player articles are not ITNR. Joseph2302 (talk) 10:02, 9 September 2024 (UTC)

  I must admit, this line of argument seems overly procedural to me -- yes, a nomination for the US Open article would have quality issues, but running the the players' articles gives us the chance update ITN with an unquestionably noteworthy event and to direct readers to two of our better articles. I don't see any guidance in WP:ITNR as to precisely which article needs to be nominated: as I read it, it's the event that has consensus to be posted, not a specific article. UndercoverClassicist ^T·C 10:28, 9 September 2024 (UTC)

  No it isn't "overly procedural". The ITNR is for showcasing the event 2024 US Open (tennis), and putting 2 articles about people that have around 1 paragraph about that event doesn't achieve this. WP:ITNR lists the event as recurring, so the event article needs to meet WP:ITNQUALITY. The solution to avoid any more discussion would be to fix the event article, because like almost all tennis articles nominated here, it has zero prose text about the events. Joseph2302 (talk) 10:38, 9 September 2024 (UTC)

• Oppose lead article(s) listed in the nomination are wrong as mentioned above. The tournament is the INTR item and not the winners. The main tournament article is no way near ready to be posted. There are all tables and scores but very little prose. I would suggest the nominator to check out the 2024 French Open and 2024 Wimbledon Championships articles (the two grand slams that were posted) to see what kind of improvements this article needs. ਪ੍ਰਿੰਸ ਆਫ਼ ਪੰਜਾਬ ^{(PrinceofPunjab | ਗੱਲਬਾਤ)} 11:06, 9 September 2024 (UTC)
• Oppose the US open article has very little prose. Fails to met the WP:ITNQUALITY. Also, since there has no work done on the article since it's nomination, I don't think it will get in shape to be posted. LiamKorda 09:06, 10 September 2024 (UTC)

Ongoing: Israel–Hezbollah conflict

Article: Israel–Hezbollah conflict (2023–present) (talk · history · tag)
Ongoing item nomination (Post)
News source(s): Al Jazeera
Credits:

• Nominated by Roncanada (talk · give credit)

Nominator's comments: Even if there is clear link with the Gaza war, this is still a different conflict, widely covered. --Roncanada (talk) 14:56, 8 September 2024 (UTC)

The linked article asserts this is part of the Israel-Hamas conflict that started in Oct 2023. I'm not seeing how it is different. The linked article above is linked in one of the top navboxes of the main Israel-Hamas page as well. Masem (t) 15:07, 8 September 2024 (UTC)

Soft oppose Problem I have with including this in the ongoing section is that currently the conflict is little more than drone and artillery strikes by both sides. If the Israeli army launched a ground offensive into Lebanon, or vice versa, than I would support inclusion. Scu ba (talk) 15:30, 8 September 2024 (UTC)

Oppose unless conflict escalates - Right now it's confined to skirmishes and not a full-scale conflict. If we must post this I say we include a spillover link in the ongoing item PrecariousWorlds (talk) 16:08, 8 September 2024 (UTC)

• Oppose per above - thus far it's just been exchanges of rocket fire and airstrikes, which is pretty much what it's been for a long time - just that they've gotten more frequent that normal. The Kip ^(contribs) 16:37, 8 September 2024 (UTC)

Oppose more similar to the Kashmiri conflict then a full scale war. Wait until a proper invasion by ground troops and then we’ll add it to ongoing. 27.96.223.192 (talk) 05:34, 9 September 2024 (UTC)

• Support it's an ongoing event and notable in itself, and is getting regular updates. Nowhere does it say it has to be full scale war for an event to be considered. Abcmaxx (talk) 08:40, 9 September 2024 (UTC)

Support as per Abcmaxx. This is an ongoing event with regular updates. I would also accept bringing back the "Spillover of the Israel-Hamas war" ongoing item. --MtPenguinMonster (talk) 10:04, 9 September 2024 (UTC)

Comment While, I leaning oppose as of right now, I would say that there are already three ongoing entries. Four would be far too much. I suggest we should one of them before adding this one. ਪ੍ਰਿੰਸ ਆਫ਼ ਪੰਜਾਬ ^{(PrinceofPunjab | ਗੱਲਬਾਤ)} 11:08, 9 September 2024 (UTC)

• • The number of ongoing items currently listed shouldn't be a factor, merely that there's just a lot going on in the world right now. Each nomination should be decided on its own merits. Abcmaxx (talk) 06:57, 10 September 2024 (UTC)
• Support merging with Israel–Hamas War ongoing. I don't see that we need two different ongoings for two different aspects of essentially the same conflict. What to call it though? "Israeli-wars"?, "Israel-Palestine conflicts"? "Palestine situation"? - it's hard to think of a title that is both encompassing and neutral. Nfitz (talk) 13:14, 9 September 2024 (UTC)

  It's not even an Israeli-Arab war it is much more nuanced than that. However, not convinced it is the same conflict. Yes, Hamas and Hezbollah are linked, and obviously one conflict escalation led to the other, but Lebanon isn’t Palestine and it brings a whole different set of issues and potential outcomes. I would argue even that what happens in the West Bank is not the same conflict as what happens in Gaza; different political forces, different area, different issues to contend with. Abcmaxx (talk) 07:44, 10 September 2024 (UTC)

• Oppose per Scu Ba and PrecariousWorlds. Flip^andFlopped ツ 21:59, 9 September 2024 (UTC)
• Oppose for now per Scu ba & PrecariousWorlds. Blaylockjam10 (talk) 22:17, 9 September 2024 (UTC)
• Oppose Per above. Spencer^T•C 04:11, 13 September 2024 (UTC)

(Posted) RD: Henny Moan

Article: Henny Moan (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): NRK
Credits:

• Nominated by Oceanh (talk · give credit)

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Norwegian actress. Seems sufficiently cited, except for filmography section (which needs citations). Oceanh (talk) 09:51, 8 September 2024 (UTC)

Per MOS:FILMCAST, a citation isn't required (though there's nothing stopping us providing one) as long as the role is credited. UndercoverClassicist ^T·C 10:30, 8 September 2024 (UTC)

FILMCAST applies to pages about films, not to BLP, which have higher standards for sourcing. Masem (t) 15:08, 8 September 2024 (UTC)

They do, but FILMCAST applies to film-related articles, not exclusively articles about films (an article on a film actor qualifies as "film-related", in my view, under any reasonable reading). The BLP sourcing standards in question are that any material challenged or likely to be challenged must be sourced. Putting those together, a citation would of course be welcome in any case, and required if there was a reasonable chance that someone would dispute whether she held a particular role. UndercoverClassicist ^T·C 16:39, 8 September 2024 (UTC)

I don't see where it says a citation is not required. Can you quote the excerpt? —Bagumba (talk) 06:47, 10 September 2024 (UTC)

For uncredited roles, a citation should be provided in accordance with Wikipedia's verifiability policy. This is a case where the exception proves the rule -- by specifying that uncredited roles need a citation, it follows that credited roles do not (necessarily) require one. It's also covered by WP:PRIMARY, which has a primary source may only be used on Wikipedia to make straightforward, descriptive statements of facts that can be verified by any educated person with access to the primary source but without further, specialized knowledge: if a credit to the person is visible when watching the film, the film itself is a sufficient citation for the statement that they held a credited role, unless there is good reason to require further (dis)proof. UndercoverClassicist ^T·C 10:41, 11 September 2024 (UTC)

So, the essence in what you are saying, is that citing the film itself (say, a dvd, or an online version) is sufficient for a credited role. But if there are no citations at all, we can not know whether the information is just taken from an «unreliable» source, such as another wiki or imdb. Oceanh (talk) 11:16, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

Yes, I suppose that would be a good way to do it, and within the spirit of WP:PRIMARY. Not required doesn't mean that it's required not to be included. UndercoverClassicist ^T·C 13:32, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

• Support Article looks well sourced. --TDKR Chicago 101 (talk) 06:23, 9 September 2024 (UTC)

Support article looks alright to me. ਪ੍ਰਿੰਸ ਆਫ਼ ਪੰਜਾਬ ^{(PrinceofPunjab | ਗੱਲਬਾਤ)} 11:09, 9 September 2024 (UTC)

• Support. No problems found. 🛧Midori No Sora♪🛪 ( ☁＝☁＝✈) 06:56, 10 September 2024 (UTC)
• Posted—Bagumba (talk) 07:16, 10 September 2024 (UTC)

(Posted) Typhoon Yagi

Article: Typhoon Yagi (talk · history · tag)
Blurb: ​ Typhoon Yagi (pictured), leaves at least 40 people dead in China, Vietnam, and the Philippines (Post)
News source(s): ChinaNews VNExpress GMA News
Credits:

• Nominated by HurricaneEdgar (talk · give credit)

The storm made historic landfall, the death toll continued to rise, and the article is in good shape. HurricaneEdgar 00:43, 8 September 2024 (UTC)

• Support: Article looks good and I feel like with 30 deaths, it should definitely be mentioned on the main page, IMO. Hacked (Talk|Contribs) 00:57, 8 September 2024 (UTC)
• Support. Much better. The article structure is good and the death and damages are notable enough for the main page. 🛧Midori No Sora♪🛪 ( ☁＝☁＝✈) 03:15, 8 September 2024 (UTC)
• Support Article is of sufficient quality for ITN. --MtPenguinMonster (talk) 03:43, 8 September 2024 (UTC)
• Support Major storm. Looks ready to post. Thriley (talk) 03:44, 8 September 2024 (UTC)
• Support both on quality and significance - compared to the last typhoon at ITN, this has a much wider spread of damage. --Masem (t) 03:54, 8 September 2024 (UTC)
• Is this the same as the below Typhoon Yagi nomination? Can the other one be closed? Natg 19 (talk) 04:01, 8 September 2024 (UTC)

  • Comment: Uh oh. Yes it is the same exact one. What now? Hacked (Talk|Contribs) 04:05, 8 September 2024 (UTC)

  Yes it is, and it was clear there was consensus to wait to see if there were more impacts from further landfalls. This one is more appropriate to keep in terms of the date of nomination since this is post-impact. Masem (t) 04:07, 8 September 2024 (UTC)

• Support per above. 🌀TyphoonAmpil🌀 (💬 - 📝) 04:24, 8 September 2024 (UTC)
• Support per previous vote to wait until the story develops -- it now has. UndercoverClassicist ^T·C 09:10, 8 September 2024 (UTC)

Support Its a current weather event, so it should be recent. Sources are reliable and the context is notable. NikolaiVektovich (talk) 16:50, 8 September 2024 (UTC)

Support as Yagi is absolutely notable enough to be in ITN. Shouldn't this be closed now? OhHaiMark (talk) 17:29, 8 September 2024 (UTC)

• Posted—Bagumba (talk) 17:40, 8 September 2024 (UTC)
• Post-posting Support - as I didn't support it last week, but now it's reeked some serious damage and death on north Vietnam, it's significant. Nfitz (talk) 13:05, 9 September 2024 (UTC)

September 7

Portal:Current events/2024 September 7

September 7, 2024 (2024-09-07) (Saturday) Armed conflicts and attacks Russian invasion of Ukraine Eastern Ukraine campaign Russian artillery targets the city of Kostiantynivka in Donetsk Oblast, Ukraine, killing three civilians and injuring three others. (Reuters) Manipur violence Ethnic violence between the Meitei and Kuki tribes kills five people in Manipur, India. The Government of Manipur orders all schools in the state to remain closed in response. (Al Jazeera) Israel–Hezbollah conflict Three Lebanese paramedics are killed and two others are wounded in an Israeli airstrike while they were firefighting in Faroun with two Amal militants killed in southern Lebanon. Hezbollah launches over 100 missiles and shelling at several Israeli military sites in Israel in retaliation. (VOA) (Middle East Eye) Disasters and accidents 2024 Pacific typhoon season Typhoon Yagi Four people are killed and at least 78 people are injured by Typhoon Yagi in Hải Dương and Quảng Ninh province, Vietnam, as it makes landfall in Hanoi. (BBC News) Thirteen people are killed and 44 others injured after a collision between a tank truck and a bus between Bouaké and Korhogo, in Ivory Coast. (AP) International relations 2024 Venezuelan political crisis, Argentina–Venezuela relations Venezuelan security forces surround the Argentine embassy in Caracas after several opposition members take refuge inside the embassy. Electricity is reportedly cut to the embassy, with Vente Venezuela describing the situation as a siege. (CNN) Law and crime Interstate 75 Kentucky shooting Several people are injured in a mass shooting near Interstate 75 in Laurel County, Kentucky, United States. (CNN) Five inmates escape from a high-security prison near Lisbon, Portugal. (Reuters) Politics and elections 2024 Algerian presidential election Algerians vote for the President, with incumbent President Abdelmadjid Tebboune expected to win a second term. (Al Jazeera) French anti-Barnier government protests Nationwide protests against Emmanuel Macron's appointment of Michel Barnier as the new prime minister break out in 130 cities and towns across France, with left-wing coalition New Popular Front claiming that Macron stole the election. (Reuters) Science and technology The Boeing Crew Flight Test capsule returns to Earth uncrewed, landing at the White Sands Space Harbor in New Mexico, United States, after being docked for three months at the International Space Station. (CNN) Sports 2024 US Open In tennis, Aryna Sabalenka defeats Jessica Pegula in the final of the US Open Women's singles tournament to win her first US Open title ever and her second Grand Slam title overall. (Reuters) (WTA)

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2024 Algerian presidential election

Article: 2024 Algerian presidential election (talk · history · tag)
Blurb: ​ Abdelmadjid Tebboune (pictured) is declared the winner of the 2024 Algerian presidential election. (Post)
Alternative blurb: ​ Abdelmadjid Tebboune (pictured) is declared the winner of the 2024 Algerian presidential election which the opposition boycotted.
News source(s): ReutersAPAl Jazeera
Credits:

• Nominated by Scu ba (talk · give credit)
• Created by Sundostund (talk · give credit)

The nominated event is listed on WP:ITN/R, so each occurrence is presumed to be important enough to post. Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article and update meet WP:ITNCRIT, not the significance.

Nominator's comments: A national election that deserves to be ITN per WP:ITN/R Scu ba (talk) 22:04, 8 September 2024 (UTC)

• Support per nominator, the article looks OK. Trepang2 (talk) 04:44, 9 September 2024 (UTC)
• Support seems fine MAL MALDIVE (talk) 04:47, 9 September 2024 (UTC)
• Wait the lede of the election article needs to be expanded as it is about only 10 words as of now. ਪ੍ਰਿੰਸ ਆਫ਼ ਪੰਜਾਬ ^{(PrinceofPunjab | ਗੱਲਬਾਤ)} 11:29, 9 September 2024 (UTC)
• Support per nominator, and as the creator. It does look OK to me. — Sundostund mppria ^{(talk / contribs)} 14:08, 9 September 2024 (UTC)
• Comment: The main story seems to be the feud pitting all the candidates against the electoral authority over voter turnout (announced as an "average" of 48%, but calculated as less than a quarter of registered voters). Perhaps it would be wise to wait until there is agreement on turnout... -- SashiRolls ^{🌿 · 🍥} 14:55, 9 September 2024 (UTC)
• Support - Checks results; 95% of the vote. Sounds very legitimate lol, but that doesn't affect notability. ITN/R, let's post but I think we should also consider adding something in the blurb about the fraudulent nature of the election PrecariousWorlds (talk) 15:11, 9 September 2024 (UTC)

• Comment @PrecariousWorlds: I stand by to my support vote, but I do agree with you that some note about the (fraudulent) nature of the election should be considered. — Sundostund mppria ^{(talk / contribs)} 17:51, 9 September 2024 (UTC)

• Comment added a new altblurb about the election not exactly being free and fair. Scu ba (talk) 19:00, 9 September 2024 (UTC)

• Comment @Scu ba: This is obviously an improvement, but consider using stronger language and label the election as "so-called" or "fraudulent". — Sundostund mppria ^{(talk / contribs)} 19:31, 9 September 2024 (UTC)

  We didn't do that for the Russian election, why would we do it for the Algerian election? Scu ba (talk) 23:03, 9 September 2024 (UTC)

There was a very long discussion as to not try and accidentally convey that the Russian election was anything more than a sham from what I remember. Abcmaxx (talk) 08:15, 10 September 2024 (UTC)

• Support: I think "which the opposition boycotted" is sufficient for the reader to join the necessary dots, and is nicely factual and verifiable, whereas "the election was fraudulent" is much trickier. UndercoverClassicist ^T·C 06:14, 10 September 2024 (UTC)

  I agree, fraud is a crime and labelling something fraudulent requires a legal process usually (as would e.g. murder or theft); given this is a de facto dictatorship we may never get any closure ever even if the regime falls as to how fraudulent or not this election is. At the same time I have long argued not to mislead by suggesting equivalency between fair and sham elections. Abcmaxx (talk) 08:13, 10 September 2024 (UTC)

• Comment: I would say that an "election" like this, where even the winner complains about irregularities alongside opposition candidates, should be subjected to stronger language than what is usual. — Sundostund mppria ^{(talk / contribs)} 10:41, 10 September 2024 (UTC)
• Oppose It seems to have been a shambles with even the winner querying the bizarre variation in the figures. And the formal result is under appeal. Presenting this as a legitimate and respectable election is misinformation. Andrew🐉(talk) 22:20, 10 September 2024 (UTC)

  @Andrew Davidson: I think we all agree that we categorically should not present this as a legitimate and respectable election; the question is how do we present it? Abcmaxx (talk) 10:51, 11 September 2024 (UTC)

  I looked at the BBC site to see how they presented the result and it doesn't appear that they have done so yet. So, that's a good clue that we should wait on further coverage rather than rushing to judgement. Andrew🐉(talk) 11:17, 11 September 2024 (UTC)

• Support altblurb - article is fine quality-wise. On the fraudulent nature, ALT1 uses the "declared the winner" language I personally prefer for questionable elections, while "which the opposition boycotted" sends the whole point home. The Kip ^(contribs) 06:09, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

RD: Diondre Overton

Article: Diondre Overton (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): CBS Sports
Credits:

• Nominated by 240F:7A:6253:1:6C2D:D568:97D0:2125 (talk · give credit)
• Updated by BeanieFan11 (talk · give credit) and Rusted AutoParts (talk · give credit)

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Former Clemson wide receiver. 240F:7A:6253:1:6C2D:D568:97D0:2125 (talk) 03:40, 8 September 2024 (UTC)

Support the article seems fine to me. ਪ੍ਰਿੰਸ ਆਫ਼ ਪੰਜਾਬ ^{(PrinceofPunjab | ਗੱਲਬਾਤ)} 11:30, 9 September 2024 (UTC)

RD: Dan Morgenstern

Article: Dan Morgenstern (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): NY Times
Credits:

• Nominated by Thriley (talk · give credit)

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Thriley (talk) 02:02, 8 September 2024 (UTC)

• Not Ready. Too short at the moment. The article needs some expansion. 🛧Midori No Sora♪🛪 ( ☁＝☁＝✈) 03:17, 8 September 2024 (UTC)

• Oppose the awards section lacks citations. ਪ੍ਰਿੰਸ ਆਫ਼ ਪੰਜਾਬ ^{(PrinceofPunjab | ਗੱਲਬਾਤ)} 11:31, 9 September 2024 (UTC)
• Support Ready to go. All cn tags now sorted and all statements have citations. Vladimir.copic (talk) 01:30, 13 September 2024 (UTC)

September 6

Portal:Current events/2024 September 6

September 6, 2024 (2024-09-06) (Friday) Armed conflicts and attacks Israeli–Palestinian conflict Israel–Hamas war Israeli invasion of the Gaza Strip At least 27 Palestinians are killed by Israeli airstrikes in cities across the Gaza Strip, including in the Nuseirat refugee camp. (Reuters) Israeli occupation of the West Bank Killing of Aysenur Eygi Ayşenur Ezgi Eygi, a Turkish American woman, is shot dead by Israeli troops during an anti-Israeli settlement protest in the West Bank. (AP) Israeli settlers and soldiers storm the Palestinian village of Qaryut, beating and opening fire against the residents, killing a 13-year-old girl and wounding two men. (Palestine News Network) Arts and culture The Chinese Ministry of Foreign Affairs announces the end of its international adoption program after suspending the program during the COVID-19 pandemic. (Al Jazeera) China opens the world's largest indoor skiing resort in Pudong, Shanghai, with a 90,000 square metres (970,000 sq ft) skiing area and a total campus area of 350,000 square metres (3,800,000 sq ft). (DW) Disasters and accidents Eighteen students are killed and 27 others are injured in a fire at a boarding school in Nyeri, Kenya. (Al Jazeera) A Piper PA-46 aircraft crashes into a cornfield after going into a nosedive in Anderson, Indiana, United States, killing all four occupants on board. (FOX59) Law and crime 2024 United Kingdom riots Sheffield Crown Court in South Yorkshire, UK, sentences Thomas Birley, a British man who set fire to a hotel that housed asylum seekers in Rotherham, South Yorkshire, to nine years in prison for arson with the intent to endanger life, the longest sentence related to the riots so far. (Al Jazeera) Prosecution of Donald Trump in New York New York Supreme Court justice Juan Merchan postpones former U.S. President Donald Trump's sentencing in his criminal case until after Election Day on November 5. (The New York Times) (Reuters) Polish prosecutors charge three Belarusian citizens for diverting Ryanair Flight 4978 under a fabricated bomb threat to arrest political activist Roman Protasevich and his girlfriend Sofia Sapega. (DW) Brazilian human rights minister Silvio Almeida is fired from his cabinet position following several accusations of sexual harassment towards women, including another cabinet minister. (Reuters)

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(Posted) RD: Rebecca Horn

Article: Rebecca Horn (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Monopol Magazine, Der Spiegel
Credits:

• Updated and nominated by Grimes2 (talk · give credit)
• Updated by Wuerzele (talk · give credit) and TDKR Chicago 101 (talk · give credit)

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

German visual artist. Grimes2 (talk) 10:40, 8 September 2024 (UTC)

• Support, detailed and referenced --Gerda Arendt (talk) 20:15, 8 September 2024 (UTC)
• Support looks sufficiently cited and detailed, I've also fixed a few references and added wikilinks. Aydoh8^[contribs] 02:29, 9 September 2024 (UTC)
• Support Article looks good. --TDKR Chicago 101 (talk) 08:15, 9 September 2024 (UTC)
• Ready the article appears ready to be posted. ਪ੍ਰਿੰਸ ਆਫ਼ ਪੰਜਾਬ ^{(PrinceofPunjab | ਗੱਲਬਾਤ)} 11:32, 9 September 2024 (UTC)
• Support Just readied a bunch of unready stuff and noticed a new CN tag (with room for more yet), but it's seemingly good enough. InedibleHulk (talk) 04:08, 10 September 2024 (UTC)
• Posted Not by me, just for the record. InedibleHulk (talk) 05:10, 10 September 2024 (UTC)

RD: Ron Yeats

Article: Ron Yeats (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): BBC Sport
Credits:

• Nominated by 240F:7A:6253:1:6C2D:D568:97D0:2125 (talk · give credit)
• Updated by Jkaharper (talk · give credit)

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Scottish footballer. 240F:7A:6253:1:6C2D:D568:97D0:2125 (talk) 03:40, 8 September 2024 (UTC)

• Oppose Several uncited statements, have added cn tags. yorkshiresky (talk) 10:43, 8 September 2024 (UTC)
• Oppose due to outstanding CN tags. Aydoh8^[contribs] 02:18, 9 September 2024 (UTC)
• Oppose orange and cn tags needs to be resolved. ਪ੍ਰਿੰਸ ਆਫ਼ ਪੰਜਾਬ ^{(PrinceofPunjab | ਗੱਲਬਾਤ)} 11:33, 9 September 2024 (UTC)

(Posted) RD: Cathy Merrick

Article: Cathy Merrick (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): CBC News
Credits:

• Created and nominated by Ornithoptera (talk · give credit)

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Indigenous leader in Canada and Grand Chief of the Assembly of Manitoba Chiefs. Ornithoptera (talk) 06:04, 7 September 2024 (UTC)

• Support looks good 27.96.223.192 (talk) 11:06, 7 September 2024 (UTC)
• Support Article has enough length and sources for posting. Cheers, atque supra! Fakescientist8000 13:28, 7 September 2024 (UTC)
• Support: article is generally in good shape, perhaps some very minor POV in places but nothing serious. UndercoverClassicist ^T·C 17:21, 7 September 2024 (UTC)
• Support. No problems found. The structure looks good enough. 🛧Midori No Sora♪🛪 ( ☁＝☁＝✈) 03:19, 8 September 2024 (UTC)
• Posted—Bagumba (talk) 12:20, 8 September 2024 (UTC)

(Posted) RD: Paul Goldsmith

Article: Paul Goldsmith (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): https://www.cbsnews.com/news/paul-goldsmith-indianapolis-500-nascar-icon-dies-at-98/
Credits:

• Updated and nominated by RegalZ8790 (talk · give credit)
• Updated by DH85868993 (talk · give credit)

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

RegalZ8790 (talk) 01:33, 7 September 2024 (UTC)

• Not quite ready. No problem with the length. However, there are several sections that are unsourced. Changing to Support. Well done and Cheers! 🛧Midori No Sora♪🛪 ( ☁＝☁＝✈) 03:21, 8 September 2024 (UTC)

  I've added citations for the flagged passages. RegalZ8790 (talk) 21:03, 8 September 2024 (UTC)

• Support no apparent issues left, looks good enough now. ਪ੍ਰਿੰਸ ਆਫ਼ ਪੰਜਾਬ ^{(PrinceofPunjab | ਗੱਲਬਾਤ)} 11:35, 9 September 2024 (UTC)
• I've had to place to citation needed tags. In addition, what's referenced in the prose is that he was born in West Virginia, whilst the infobox gives a specific place. Schwede66 01:27, 10 September 2024 (UTC)

  I've added or improved citations for the flagged passages. RegalZ8790 (talk) 05:10, 11 September 2024 (UTC)

  @Schwede66, I've expanded the prose and added an image. RegalZ8790 (talk) 02:38, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

  Nah, that won’t do. Ancestry.com is a user-generated database and therefore not a reliable source. If there aren’t reliable sources that can confirm those details, I suggest that this needs to be referenced for 1925 and West Virginia, assuming that those sources exist, RegalZ8790. Schwede66 16:15, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

  @Schwede66, please consult the new citation, an article published by the United States Auto Club announcing Goldsmith's death. Please let me know what else, in specific, remains to be done in order for this article to garner your support. I am concerned about the time we have left remaining. Thank you for your input. RegalZ8790 (talk) 02:26, 13 September 2024 (UTC)

• Posted – Schwede66 04:27, 13 September 2024 (UTC)

(Closed) Ongoing: Brazilian investigation into Elon Musk

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

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Article: Brazilian investigation into Elon Musk (talk · history · tag)
Blurb: No blurb specified (Post)
News source(s): Vide previous candidate
Credits:

• Nominated by ArionStar (talk · give credit)

ArionStar (talk) 23:06, 6 September 2024 (UTC)

• Oppose We’ve already had a nomination for this. 27.96.223.192 (talk) 01:08, 7 September 2024 (UTC)
• Oppose We have never put ongoing court actions on the ongoing line, nor would this be a case of that much import to be the first such one. --Masem (t) 01:32, 7 September 2024 (UTC)
• Oppose already discussed below with no consensus to post. This nomination is just trying to game the process. Natg 19 (talk) 02:35, 7 September 2024 (UTC)
• Oppose Already proposed Aug. 31. No means no. --Pats2017 (talk) 03:02, 7 September 2024 (UTC)

• Oppose Article discussion has already been closed with no consensus to post, no need to add this to ongoing after that. Hungry403 (talk) 03:48, 7 September 2024 (UTC)
• Oppose there was no consensus to post this less than a week ago, and with all due respect the nom was one of the users lobbying for it. The Kip ^(contribs) 05:43, 7 September 2024 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

RD: Sérgio Mendes

Article: Sérgio Mendes (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Variety, LA Times
Credits:

• Nominated by 240F:7A:6253:1:E121:3DD7:6095:EC33 (talk · give credit)
• Updated by Jkaharper (talk · give credit), Rblourenco (talk · give credit), Sunshineisles2 (talk · give credit) and Martinevans123 (talk · give credit)

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Brazilian musician. 240F:7A:6253:1:E121:3DD7:6095:EC33 (talk) 16:06, 6 September 2024 (UTC)

• Support once ready: A front-figure of bossa nova and one of the most famous Brazilian musicians of all time, together with Antônio Carlos Jobim and Vinicius de Moraes. The article still needs a lot of sources, though, and I'm afraid I won't be able to help myself... Oltrepier (talk) 16:30, 6 September 2024 (UTC)

  @Oltrepier: notability isn't a factor in RD nominations, as having an article is proof of notability in itself Abcmaxx (talk) 17:36, 6 September 2024 (UTC)

• Oppose, article has sourcing maintenance tag, citation needed tags and several unsourced paragraphs. Suonii180 (talk) 20:45, 6 September 2024 (UTC)

Oppose orange tag, unsourced awards section and only 8 references for a bit long article. ਪ੍ਰਿੰਸ ਆਫ਼ ਪੰਜਾਬ ^{(PrinceofPunjab | ਗੱਲਬਾਤ)} 11:37, 9 September 2024 (UTC)

(Closed) San Marino national football team

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

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Article: San Marino national football team (talk · history · tag)
Blurb: ​ San Marino national football team, the lowest-ranked FIFA-affiliated national team, wins the first competitive victory in their 36-year history (Post)
News source(s): ESPN.com
Credits:

• Nominated by Holapaco77 (talk · give credit)

Holapaco77 (talk) 11:50, 6 September 2024 (UTC)

• Oppose Sports trivia. --Masem (t) 12:30, 6 September 2024 (UTC)
• Oppose We should not be posting the results of individual games, unless possibly it is a championship game. Gödel2200 (talk) 12:42, 6 September 2024 (UTC)
• Oppose whilst one of the worst sports teams in history winning did garner some coverage, this doesn't meet WP:ITNQUALITY, not least because it's probably not important enough to have its own article. Joseph2302 (talk) 12:49, 6 September 2024 (UTC)
• Oppose - seems more like a Did You Know. Nfitz (talk) 14:29, 6 September 2024 (UTC)

• Oppose big news for all the Tim Traveller fans out there, but ITN isn't the place for this, belongs in a did you know blurb. Scu ba (talk) 15:58, 6 September 2024 (UTC)
• Oppose target article football is the world's biggest sport and San Marino has a unique place within it. However, if this singular win is that notable, then really there should be an article about the match itself. Abcmaxx (talk) 17:33, 6 September 2024 (UTC)
• Re-opened after closure (Much as I love San Marino, consensus to post won't develop. The Kip ^(contribs) 19:09, 6 September 2024 (UTC)}}); maybe it won't reach consensus, but really not even half a day is certainly too short a time span to be closing any nomination. Let's give a chance for others to comment. Abcmaxx (talk) 20:27, 6 September 2024 (UTC)
• Oppose per Masem. 31.44.224.222 (talk) 21:10, 6 September 2024 (UTC)
• Oppose Congrats to San Marino! Cool story, but more fitting for DYK than ITN. --Pats2017 (talk) 01:42, 7 September 2024 (UTC)
• Oppose while this is probably significant news for San Marino, I fail to see how this is really significant for the rest of the world. Editor 5426387 (talk) 04:10, 7 September 2024 (UTC)
• Oppose Ten to nothing, "remarkable". InedibleHulk (talk) 05:36, 7 September 2024 (UTC)

Oppose While interesting, it's more suited for DYK than ITN, as per Pats2017 and Nfitz. --MtPenguinMonster (talk) 07:57, 7 September 2024 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

References

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